[taurath]

I have about half of those traits - again I’m not saying ADHD isn’t a possible factor to some level :). I have a laser focus, but no time blindness (just memory gaps related to dissociation), I don’t have a ton of in progress projects, I feel calm in emergencies (every emergency is simpler than my catastrophizing mind has already come up with), I have a hypersensitivity to some stimulants and normal w others, I don’t really speak too fast for people nor listen to vids at 1.5/2x, I can infodump but don’t unless I’m damn sure they wanna hear it, I have auditory sensitivity/a bit of a filtering problem in loud places but rarely miss what someone in front of me is saying, I don’t complete others sentences often (it’s usually rude), and I like writing long messages about things I have spent a lot of my life learning about. I also do relate things to myself when empathizing but also sometimes don’t if someone is in obvious distress.

Broadly a lot of those can come from different sources I think. A lot of mental horsepower could explain many of them, in a way?

Otoh, I basically raised myself emotionally - I had absent (emotionally) or commandeering parents and had a very insecure early attachment. I spent most of my time from middle and high school drugged up on medications and spent a ton of time alone - a big factor there was it was I was raised in an extreme religious environment and told I was better than everyone else and that I should act in an extremely specific “godly” way that opened me up for lots of bullying. Pulling apart the pieces of “what happened” has been a lifelong task.

[romwell]

Thank you again for a detailed answer! From what you are saying, I would not be quick to suggest that you have ADHD either.

For one, the traits that you listed are in the overlap with ASD (to my knowledge).

Re-reading your comments, it looks like you don't feel like ASD applies to you however there is even less good information about ASD than about ADHD or PTSD. I never thought it could apply to me until I looked at some recent materials on it.

FWIW, I'm a social butterfly too, and never felt I have trouble reading faces, but growing up with a BPD parent, being able to detect an incoming rage was a vital skill which I developed early on. At the same time, self-assessments (as well as relatable experiences of autistic people with ADHD) indicate at least a likelihood of ASD for me as well.

"Autistics can't read faces" is straight up a myth. I don't know how much you looked into ASD communities on social media, but it's amazing just how many false beliefs persisted in the medical community for ages. FFS, we only stopped zapping autistic kids for being autistic last year.

There are a lot of misconceptions about ASD that have been resolved only in recent years. The traits you said don't apply to you, in fact, are known to not match the experience of many autistic people.

The thing about an autism diagnosis as an adult is that it doesn't really bring much value. There are no meds. You have already figured out all the coping mechanisms and necessary masking to get by in life. And if you are in control of your environment, then it doesn't affect you negatively.

Like, sensory sensitivity is not an issue in your own home, and you can avoid environments that make you uncomfortable. Same goes for people. Hyperfocus is an asset more than anything else.

So for me, finding out that I might be on the spectrum was a curious observation that could explain some of my behavior patterns, but didn't need much attention (unlike the trauma, which I'm only beginning to approach, or ADHD).

I wish I knew more about ASD to ask the right questions, but out of curiosity:

* What is your relationship with planning? Do you tend to plan most of the things that you do? Do you enjoy unplanned activities? How do you react when the plans you made are suddenly changed?

* How easy is it for you to lie? Do you feel comfortable telling a falsehood when answering a question?

* What's your relationship with things? When you buy something (say, a gadget), how long do you use it for? Is it easy for you to throw things away? Can you tell stories associated with most of the things that you own?

* Have you ever had other people confused about your emotions? Like, being perceived as feeling very emotional when you aren't, and vice versa; or otherwise having a mismatch about how others read you, and how you feel.

* The things that you'd be glad to infodump about upon request - how long have you been interested in them, on the average?

* Have you ever felt that you are being clear and direct, but another person took it personally and got offended for no good reason (other than them being unable to hold a coherent argument)? If so, does this happen regularly?

Thank you again for giving such detailed answers, they are very helpful, and help me understand CPTSD, ADHD, and ASD better (as well as myself)!

[taurath]

My relationship with ASD is that I toiled under a misunderstanding of my capabilities tied to an ASD diagnosis early on. ASD being a spectrum, finding even relevant information towards one particular area over another on the spectrum has always been a challenge. I'm of the opinion that, like ADHD, the diagnostic criteria is very open to interpretation and relatively wide. I would prefer if there were specific neurological, gene, or behavioral markers that were more "NT's don't do this, ASD people do do this".

Just as I may have some level of ADHD, I may have some level of ASD. Treatment methodologies I tried in my 20s, and were tried on me in my teens, were grouped around treatment of either or both of those. Ultimately they were not effective at giving me much better quality of life, whereas trauma-informed methodologies have been, especially in aspects like emotional regulation, and giving reasons for say dissociative episodes which had plagued me for a very long time and now are much more manageable, and also predictable.

To your q's...

I plan some of the things I do, but I don't have the need to plan everything. I do well in planned and unplanned environments. I have traveled to foreign countries solo, gotten into plenty of fun sorts of trouble, etc. When I am needing something emotionally like time alone to recharge, or support, a sudden change in environment like a ton of people coming over suddenly can be jarring or upsetting.

I don't like lying. I feel like its not worth it, and then you also have to remain consistent in the lies. If I needed to get past the gestapo in my car with a trunk full of refugee's, I would probably be able to keep a relatively straight face while lying through my teeth and not thinking another thought about the lie later :P

I use a gadget as long as I have need or want of it. I don't attach to objects more than people, if thats sort of the idea. I don't like throwing away things I've spent a bunch of money on, but I don't hoard.

Hard to say but usually I think I'm pretty obvious about my emotional state - for the most part it matches.

This is probably one of my main things to "infodump". I've been having to study psychology, pharmacology, etc from a damn early age because I was raised alongside the idea that there's something wrong with me. I've spent a very long time trying to help my at the time really distressing depression and anxiety and lack of self worth. I tend to get bored of things after a little bit. I played chess for a while, and then found that the endgames weren't terribly interesting. Same via programming, history, social studies/social justice. Idk, I don't have super singular "special interests", I just like to learn and know a lot about a lot.

I am pretty aware of any tone problems. I think it used to happen that I was somewhat blunt, especially in teen years but its hard to differentiate between that as an ASD thing of "not getting" or simply ignoring how words effect other's emotional states, being raised in an incredibly strict and regimented way, and being undersocialized generally. Its funny because I'm aware I'm sort of replying in writing in a sort of matter of fact tone. If you don't mind, I'd not mind some feedback on my writing style and how it strikes you.

[romwell]

Thanks for answering the questions!

The answers you give are not inconsistent with ASD to my knowledge. However, I'm not even sure what's there to treat.

It seems like a lot of "treatment" of ASD traits in children was just making them conform to expectations of an "average" person, which may contribute to trauma and make quality of life worse.

People who mask better look like they're "improving" to outside observers, but might be just behaving in a way more pleasant to others, but also more draining and leading to other issues.

"Attaching to objects more than to people" is, I feel, some nonsense that's made up by people without a clue. I can talk at length about the things that I have, and why I have them; but that would be another long comment :)

Your style strikes me as: direct, precise, detailed, easy to understand, answering the question asked, including information on why you think the way you do (i.e. basis for claims), not taking things personally, having capacity to elaborate on thoughts and ideas in more than one paragraph, and a pleasure to read overall.

From my personal experience, this style seems to be more common with neurodivergent people (ASD specifically). The length of your (...and mine) comments alone seems to be a good enough indicator :)

The "tone problems", I feel, are what other people have because they communicate indirectly, and try looking for signal where there is none. I sometimes have to ask to just listen to the words that I say, and take them at face value, rather than trying to impart another meaning to them based on my tone (which is usually affected by the things that are on my mind to a larger extent than the things I am talking about).

Also, again, sorry to hear that you were receiving treatment that was not helping you. The traits that you describe that may be ASD traits don't look like something that needs to be "treated".

Also, on this:

>I'm of the opinion that, like ADHD, the diagnostic criteria is very open to interpretation and relatively wide. I would prefer if there were specific neurological, gene, or behavioral markers that were more "NT's don't do this, ASD people do do this".

The DSM criteria are little more than guidelines.

The following book does exactly what you described:

I Think I Might Be Autistic: A Guide to Autism Spectrum Disorder Diagnosis and Self-Discovery for Adults[1]

It starts with a categorized "NT's don't do this, ASD people do do this" checklist.

In addition, self-assessments like RAADS-R - over 100 questions[2] and AQ - 50 questions[3] are, essentially, that: yes/no questions where NTs would more likely choose one of the answers, and ASD people the other.

(Do read the information on the page if you decide to take them: these tests have been revised because the researchers were flat out wrong about some of those!)

>Ultimately they were not effective at giving me much better quality of life, whereas trauma-informed methodologies have been

Well, trauma is both very common in non-NT people, and also it's something that can affect people the most and exacerbate other traits that aren't helpful in that situation.

I feel like ASD is not really something to be treated in adults who already live their lives somehow, just something to be aware of because it's useful to know how others differ from you, and what expectations to have about the way your mind works (because we build them on understanding that only applies to some NT people).

The helpful part of learning about ASD for me was learning about masking, and doing less of that. This is not specific to ASD (though there are some who'd want to restrict the usage of that word, but that's a whole another can of worms); and catching myself acting a certain way because that's the expectation of others, and not because I want to do this (or not doing something) helps me spend less energy on things that aren't worth it.

In any case, it seems like trauma is something that should have been helped with first based on my understanding of what you said, and it's very sad to hear that the docs didn't arrive at the same conclusion.

Sorry that you didn't get help right away, glad you eventually did! Thank you so much for writing all of this, and I hope there is something of value in this wall of text too.

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[1]https://www.amazon.com/Think-Might-Autistic-Diagnosis-Self-D...

[2]https://embrace-autism.com/raads-r/

[3]https://embrace-autism.com/autism-spectrum-quotient/