[temp8964]

It seems you are trapped in the idea that humanness is defined by brain function. Which is obviously wrong to me, but I am not interested in expanding the discussion.

Also it is important whether it is a consequence of the mother's voluntary behavior, because if it is not then the human embryo would not have end up inside her body. So yes, it matters.

Thanks, I am just saying atheist can be against abortion. No more argument with me is needed.

[michaelmrose]

As an atheist it would seem dualism would be out of bounds so given that your brain is you in a very literal sense what other factor do you believe defines humanness? I think therefore I am seems like the strongest possible argument here.

[temp8964]

No. Brain alone does not define humanness. You can do a few thought experiments, such as:

lab-grown full function brain, would it be treated as a human?

lab-grown baby with brain development stopped at day x, would it be treated simply as a pile of meat?

adult after accident left with x% brain function, would it be treated simply as a pile of meat?

Just use your brain, you will see it is not that easy.

[michaelmrose]

A fully functional lab grown brain would BE a human regardless of how it would be treated.

If the baby or the human had a sufficiently damaged or deficient brain it WOULD be a pile of meat. If they weren't treated as such it would be because of an emotional connection as opposed to a logical reason. This is all you've posited in this comment. Emotional situations designed to confuse the issue. I am using my brain, specifically to cut through the fog.