[ArchieMaclean]

Of course we should be doing all we can to prevent murder! It is just always hard to tell with statistics and having a more honest statistic (that, say, shows that murder rates have doubled while number of activists have increased 30%) would be preferable.

[squarefoot]

The increasing number of activists murders to me only indicates that the killers and especially whoever is behind them isn't being caught and is still free to eliminate again and again people they find inconvenient for their businesses. If each one of them was arrested and given a life sentence after each murder, whether committed or by contract, we probably would have solved the problem ages ago. Those people have shitloads of money at disposal for hiring gunmen, so I expect they can buy other people among the local law enforcement too.

[yunohn]

I’m not sure what kind of number you’re looking for. There’s no global registry tracking the population of environmental activists - just that when people are murdered by anti-green corporations, we can figure out that the person’s activism is what caused it.

[strken]

Quoting from the methodology section of the report:

> To meet our criteria, a case must be supported by the following available information:

> Credible, published and current online sources of information.

> Details about the type of act and method of violence, including the date and location.

> Name and biographical information about the victim.

> Clear, proximate and documented connections to an environmental or land issue.

When people are murdered, we can't be sure who did it unless there's evidence. The methodology doesn't seem to include gathering evidence of who the murderer was, only that the murder happened to an activist. Saying "when people are murdered by anti-green corporations" is begging the question, because the report doesn't pass on any evidence that they were murdered by anyone in particular.

[yunohn]

I wasn’t aware that we’ve devolved to questioning the murders and defending the megacorps with the most to gain.

Who else do you think is going around conveniently getting rid of activists that oppose profit and greed?

[Veen]

> Who else do you think is going around conveniently getting rid of activists that oppose profit and greed?

You're missing the point. People are murdered all the time for all sorts of reasons, including people who happen to be activists. The question is: are activists being murdered for their activism or for some other reason? Until you can demonstrate that, you simply don't have grounds to suspect megacorps or their agents are doing the murdering.

For example, the number of people who listen to Ed Sheeran music has risen enormously in the last decade. So has the number of Ed Sheeran listeners who were murdered. It doesn't follow that they were murdered because they have dubious taste in music—just that as the population of Sheeran fans grows so does the number of people in it being murdered. That might happen even if the overall murder rate was going down.

[yunohn]

I love the Ed Sheeran comparison and misdirect. I’ll stop feeding the troll now.

[ArchieMaclean]

While you won't be able to get a hard number of people, you could get a general number/trend (e.g. by counting the increase of people to rallies)

[yunohn]

I’m pretty sure activists are not just “people who show up to rallies”. Especially not the kind that a megacorp is trying to murder.

[jamesrcole]

the idea that there's no possible way to reasonably estimate the number of environmental activists seems very unlikely to me.

[yunohn]

Do you happen to have some sources for a reasonable estimation on the number of, say…

• hackers? • crackers? • political activists?

[jamesrcole]

nope. What has that got to do with my comment? Someone was implying that it was impossible, I was saying that claim was implausible. People estimate those kinds of numbers all the time for statistical purposes.

[happymellon]

So you are okay with corporate murder, as long as they don't murder more than have become activists as a ratio?

If murder rates have doubled that is bad, regardless of the number of people becoming activists.

[Sebb767]

It's important to see the direction we're going in. If the number of activists increased by an order of magnitude (for example), we would be on a great trajectory to reduce these murders. If the number of activists stayed the same, this would be a horrible development.

Of course corporate murder is horrible, but the world is on fire (quite literally). Without putting the numbers in perspective, there's no way to tell whether we need to put our resources towards fighting activist murders or, for example, clan criminality.

[ArchieMaclean]

Of course I'm not "okay with corporate murder".

I just wanted to see some context as to why the rate was increasing.