[natvert]

The people who are for forcing everyone else to take the vaccine don't understand how strongly people's beliefs (including their own) are held. What if the anti-vaxers we're forcing everyone to not get the vaccine or be fired?

Requirements such as the vaccine mandate will not have the intended effect, but perhaps even the opposite. Want more people to quit their jobs? Requiring everyone to put something in their bodies they don't want there is a great way to do it!

[raxxorrax]

I am vaccinated, but the paternalism of mandates and passes almost ensures I will never take any booster or share health info when I don't have to.

These people need to be told 'no' in no uncertain terms for them to understand, otherwise this will only escalate. You can enforce any behavior with a security argument and I think Covid is still a bad justification for many measures we see today. There are also vaccinated regions where cases are rising again, much more so than before even.

Everyone that wanted to get vaccinated got a chance to do so, so any rules should be taken back. Those still in danger because they cannot get vaccinated have to deal with the risk themselves. That is manageable if you abdicate of some things, but it risk isn't large enough to restrict others.

[johnisgood]

Health care workers here must get vaccinated against COVID-19. What happened is LOTS of nurses and so forth quitting their job. Not enough nurses was already a huge issue, now it is way worse.

[Mountain_Skies]

Seems like every hospital administrator assumed that they'd be able to rely on hiring a bunch of travel nurses to cover the gap but then discovered every other hospital administrator in the country had the same idea.

[newacct583]

I don't know where "here" is but while health care workers are hard to staff there's no particular vaccine effect I'm aware of. Cite?

[newacct583]

> The people who are for forcing everyone else to take the vaccine don't understand how strongly people's beliefs (including their own) are held.

Interestingly that's not borne out by polling. Very, very few people cop to being unvaccinated for principled reasons. Almost all the unvaccinated are simply unreached -- they live in an environment where "everyone" is unvaccinated and no one is telling them to do it. So they never called to make the appointment because it seemed weird.

Well, now someone is telling them to do it.

[Mountain_Skies]

Maybe that's what they want. Then they can blame those who haven't taken the shots for the labor shortage crisis that currently is being blamed mainly on government unemployment benefits and other assistance programs.

[gpapilion]

States already have robust vaccine requirements for public education. As a society we have decided we can do this for a slew of childhood diseases, but we've for some reason drawn the line on things like the flu vaccine. Basically the only reason we don't have these for adults is because you had requirements as a child to be vaccinated.

[turdferguson]

Yea, childhood diseases that require one single vaccine or a series of boosters that have been thoroughly tested and vetted for decades. This vaccine is not equivalent to those vaccines. You can’t eradicate Covid the same way you can with smallpox or polio. It’s not the same at all.

[Red_Leaves_Flyy]

The scenarios are in fact very similar. Perhaps you should learn about the antivaxxers of yore.

https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/long-view-ye-olde-anti-vax...

[mikem170]

Maybe not a good enough job was done explaining and educating people on the reasons, risks, and odds. Both then and now.

It seems like it would be better to convince people than to try to force them. Many don't take kindly to being forced.

And if you can't convince them, perhaps there's not enough reason to force them.

[Red_Leaves_Flyy]

The needs of the many, those at greater risk of death and disability as a consequence of COVID and the strained hospitals failing to keep up with the volume of patients, outweigh the minute risks a covid vaccine poses to any generic individual. Anyone still on the fence is willfully ignorant and has likely drank far too much of the antivax koolaid.

[mikem170]

That's not going to convince anyone that thinks differently than you, especially the koolaid part.

Even honest people who agree on a set of numbers, like the current U.S. death count of 1 in 493 people, may interpret those numbers quite differently. There's also still plenty of unsettled science around masks and lockdowns, and it's a shame that the news is not more honest about all this. Credibility matters.

I think it helps to quantify things with numbers where possible, with experts to help put those numbers into context, and being prepared to answer follow-up questions and objections.

Personally I agree with you that the vaccine makes sense for individuals. But I'm not so sure about what you also allude to, how much of a difference that trying to force an extra 15-20% of the population to get vaccinated is going to make to those at greater risk. Those at greater risk will still be at greater risk, from delta (which the vaccinated can spread), the flu, other respirator ailments, their old age and comorbidities, etc. It's not an argument that's going to convince someone who thinks the danger of whole pandemic has been exaggerated. Remember that 1 in 493 number. Some people don't think that's a big deal, given how good we are in the modern age at keeping old and sick people alive until something like this gets them.

Forcing people makes them resentful, both personally and politically. Dismissing their opinions as unworthy sure doesn't help. And then comes the politicians and media ready to amplify and ride the wave of the disaffected, for better or worse. Alienating people for marginal benefit carries its own risk, too.

[CheezeIt]

Those requirements are for seriously lethal or damaging diseases that weren’t going away. COVID-19 has reached its last major peak in late August.