[imacerealkiller]

>it takes a long time to undo the damage such profound discrimination causes

yes and for many, the damage is irreversible. Denied access to education is also a big factor Blacks face. If you are unable to study and get a good education, you can't work a decent job. It's then harder for you to let your children study to tertiary level as you might need them to step out to work earlier to contribute to the house, and they are then stuck in lower paying jobs. The cycle then continues when they have kids and when their kids have kids and it goes on for many generations.

[reacharavindh]

This is precisely why Education should not be treated as a business. If Education was free for every citizen, it does a lot to bring equality of opportunity (it does not fix all of the damages from discrimination, but aids significantly in recovery). So is healthcare.

Having experienced education and healthcare in USA and Denmark, I cannot believe such extremes exist in the same world. It blows my mind that the wealthiest country on Earth by such a huge margin could not give its citizens unified and free healthcare and free access to Education. Just imagine what would happen to American economy in the long run if people were free to educate themselves(better workforce) and didn't need to go bankrupt because they got an unfortunate health condition?

I am sad that there are no politicians that think about these in long term. Everyone seems to only care about the next election cycle.

[imacerealkiller]

Even if education is free, having time to study is also a luxury we take for granted. Going to university means a few more years of them not being able to work full-time and contribute to the household income. But for sure, if education was free it would improve access to education and restore some balance.

[tester34]

>Going to university means a few more years of them not being able to work full-time and contribute to the household income. But for sure, if education was free it would improve access to education and restore some balance.

In Poland you can attend higher edu institutions on weekends and work meanwhile.

It often costs you like 1.x * minimal wage per semester, thus in total like 17K PLN for bachelor/engineering degree (3.5 years).

I did it, those a few years will be hard for you when it comes to free time, but I think it's decent trade off, especially if your job is already related to what you're studying, so this way you can have both: degree and work experience.

[darkwater]

> In Poland you can attend higher edu institutions on weekends and work meanwhile.

> It often costs you like 1.x * minimal wage per semester, thus in total like 17K PLN for bachelor/engineering degree (3.5 years).

It is indeed something, but why poorer people need 2-3x effort to reach the same level of education? Why are many people against things like public income and free public schools which would fix issues like this? Why do we focus on the ones exploiting the system to get "easy money" instead of focusing on people already exploited by the system which would benefit from this?

[imacerealkiller]

This sounds like a great system and more countries should implement this. In Singapore (where I'm born), there's night classes/part-time degrees for people who need to work. It would be wonderful if more countries recognized the need for flexible studying options like Poland.

[nitrogen]

US state-run colleges and universities usually offer night classes as well, but they are just as expensive as day classes.

[cplanas]

In some European countries, like Denmark, students get a salary.

[NateEag]

The US public school system is "no additional charge" - you have to pay taxes to help fund it regardless of whether you use it, but you do not have to pay anything beyond those taxes for your children to attend.

It may not be much good, but that's a different question.

[freeopinion]

This is the fantasy of public education. It is the time of year where we experience the reality of public education. Many parents in the U.S. just spent thousands of dollars in "additional charges" to enroll their children in public schools.

[reacharavindh]

True, there is a public school system in the US. I missed to recognise it. As you say, whether or not it is sufficient is another debate.

When I wrote my comment, my thoughts were around higher education though - not primary, middle and high schools. The ones like college education and higher education where people pay through the roof and rack up debts that stay with them for decades.

[dominotw]

There are state schools, I got my bachelors and masters from university of alabama and funded it by working at a gas station. In state tuition was ~1200/semester back in 2005. I graduated with ~5k student loan that i paid off in 2 yrs post graduation.

[KittenInABox]

FWIW I looked at University of Alabama tuition now and for an academic year was 10k in-state, or 5k/semester assuming 2 semesters a year. (With fees, room, and board, the total comes over 25k/year.)

So you most certainly can't fund your education at the same institution working at a gas station now with only 5k student loans.

[dominotw]

> With fees, room, and board, the total comes over 25k/year

We lived off campus 4 ppl in a 2 bed ( ~100/head). My total living expense was ~350/month. My parents had recently immigrated, so i was totally ok with not having a "college experience" or actually knew what exactly it was. I was able to find another job on campus as an attendent at computer lab which game plenty of time to relax and do coursework.

I agree that now it might not be possible. But its doable if you get grants( which most of my classmates did) and are ok slumming it out though college.

[alistairSH]

Many communities in the US actively cripple their public schools via poor funding (and then send their kids to private schools, leaving only the poor behind).

[dredmorbius]

"Segregation Academies", still highly prevalent across the south.

But most of these schools remain overwhelmingly white institutions, both because of their founding ethos and because tuition fees are a barrier to entry. In communities where many or most white students are sent to these private schools, the percentages of African-American students in tuition-free public schools are correspondingly elevated. For example, in Clarksdale, Mississippi, as of 2010, 92% of the students at Lee Academy were white, while 92% of the students at Clarksdale High School were black.[4] The effects of this de facto racial segregation are compounded by the unequal quality of education produced in communities where whites served by former segregation academies seek to minimize tax levies for public schools.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segregation_academy

The evangelical movement was central to the formation, promotion, and organisation of the segregation academy movement.

https://ir.vanderbilt.edu/handle/1803/10763

[coryrc]

We spend more than almost every country. It's not low in poor areas either; for example, Detroit Public Schools has much higher funding than the state average in Michigan.

The problem is not the amount being spent.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/sep/07/us-education...

[mensetmanusman]

It’s complicated by the fact that if you do give the public schools money, they spend it on $10 million football facilities for 15 year olds, this is what happened in our community.

[bildung]

No idea about the specific situation in the US, but in my experience these kinds of distortions are almost always because said public school can only get the 10M for sports facilities because there is a specific fund for exactly this but not general school funding. The school then applies for it anyway because that means they can divert 100k or some other paltry share of said funds to be used for general school equipment etc.

[catawbasam]

This is true for core instruction but not sports and other extracurricular, which are Pay-fors in many parts of the US. Robert Putnam's "Our Kids" (great book!) is eloquent on the costs and consequences.

[nceqs3]

Denmark just passed a law that limits the number of non-white people in a neighborhood.

[reacharavindh]

I'd be shocked if it were true. Where did you see such a law?

[shrikant]

It sounded rubbish, so I looked it up and it's a thing! :-O

https://www.dw.com/en/why-denmark-is-clamping-down-on-non-we...

[reacharavindh]

I knew the immigration policies in DK were bad. But, not this bad. While I lived there, myself, and my Danish friends were embarrassed by the obviously discriminatory policies targeted at differently looking people. Particularly, the idiotic law about a handshake with he mayor to confirm naturalisation in Denmark. Under the assumption that Islamic women will hesitate to go through it. The rhetoric from the Folkeparty was always a cause of embarrassment in the Danish society. I did not live near the Copenhagen area where I imagine most immigrant neighbourhoods tend to be around. I realise that I may have been living 4 years a bubble and thinking everyone is so nice and liberal, and always care for the greater good.

It saddens me to know about such discrimination in a country that gets so many things right.

It breaks my heart to just read the following quote from the article linked above.

"I talk with children who are living in this area, and they believe they are Danish because they are born Danish, they have Danish passports, they speak Danish, they go to schools here — but people always tell them: 'You're not Danish because you're Muslim.'"

- This is not a hallmark of an open society. All the Danish people I know (in my apparent bubble) don't care about religion. Just let people be who they are, practice whatever religion they want. I wholeheartedly agree with not allowing anybody to impose their religion on others (this applies to the politicians imposing their beliefs on immigrants too).

I sincerely hope that things turn around for the better, and the reasonable voices of the Danish society votes the discriminatory people out.

[reacharavindh]

By any chance are you Shrikant Narasimhan from Chennai, India that went to the jail that was Sairam Engineering College back in 2006? If so, I sat on a few quiz rounds with you and Vinod.....

[shrikant]

Indeed I am :) DM/email to talk further?

[nitrogen]

Would integration into Danish society be worse if immigrant communities formed insular enclaves? I can see a rational reason to encourage cultural intermixing, so that different cultural groups have to be aware of and support each other.

[cplanas]

I lived in DK, and as shocking as it sounds, it's true. Just a nitpick: the law is not exactly against "non-white" people, but about "non-Western". African-Americans would count as Western, Russians would not. But in effect, the policy affects mainly Muslims: it was probably designed with that in mind.

[klyrs]

Now I'm really curious how many African Americans are emigrating to Denmark.

[lotsofpulp]

Source?

[nceqs3]

https://www.dw.com/en/why-denmark-is-clamping-down-on-non-we...

[coryrc]

Perhaps we shouldn't have watered down the k-12 system so that a high school degree meant something.