[ruined]

there are many pet horror stories of bird deaths from PTFE pans, typically from accidents, but occasionally from normal use. one may assume that it happens quite often without a canary in the kitchen so to speak, and thus goes unnoticed.

also, damaging the coating is known to lower the temperature at which PTFE will pyrolize. anecdotally i don’t think i’ve seen a single teflon pan in anyone’s home that didn’t have some damage unless it was nearly new.

most situations that people are exposed to PTFE fumes are certainly below the level that triggers acute illness, but i wouldn’t be surprised if it was very common to get enough exposure to contribute to cancer, but it would be very hard to verify or test for that specific cause.

[nate_meurer]

The bird thing has attained mythological status, but I'm not convinced. The story appears to have been popularized by the 2003 "Canaries in the Kitchen" article from the Environmental Working Group. It should be noted that every one of the citations in this article is an anecdotal story. Nowhere do they cite any research showing that sub-pyrolytic heating of PTFE can kill birds in realistic environments.

One problem with the anecdata here is that birds can be killed by all kinds of other fumes and smoke, including ordinary cooking fumes, which makes it impossible to isolate the variables in a non-laboratory setting. Shit, you can kill birds with just the natural gas from your stove, or with the vaporized mineral oil burned off a new toaster.

As for burning up a nonstick pan, sure, I don't think anyone doubts that's lethal to birds. But I don't believe birds are harmed by nonstick cookware under normal conditions. If anyone has evidence to the contrary, I'd like to see it.

> damaging the coating is known to lower the temperature at which PTFE will pyrolize

Overheating can definitely impair the coating's adhesion to the cooking surface, which makes it more vulnerable to flaking in the future, but the breakdown temperatures of the coating system components aren't changed. They are what they are.

I have many well-used nonstick pans, some nearly a decade old, and on the inside they're flawless like the day I bought them. Except the one I gouged with an immersion blender. I use silicone, nylon, and wood utensils, and I don't overheat them.

> it would be very hard to verify or test for that specific cause.

It's not that hard to get good retrospective data. There are many thousands of workers who have spent years working in the fluorinated chemical industry, and as far as I know there's no evidence of higher cancer rates among that population.