[masklinn]

People like templates, and the clear and declarative correspondence between input and output.

You can write React without using JSX, and I assume Vue without templates, but unless the components system has a declarative layer so thin it might as well be templates (e.g. elm, or clojure’s hiccup) and it is entirely expression based, they’ll want templates.

Wicket looks like absolute nonsense of the worst kind. It completely reminds me of Struts and Spring and friends, and that is not a positive comparison.

[lmm]

> People like templates, and the clear and declarative correspondence between input and output.

You don't get that clear correspondence if you can have logic in your templates, and even supposedly simple expression languages in templates somehow always end up growing ifs, looping constructs and so on. Plain HTML fragments are good, but they need to be kept absolutely simple.

> Wicket looks like absolute nonsense of the worst kind. It completely reminds me of Struts and Spring and friends, and that is not a positive comparison.

I don't understand your position at all. The problems of Struts and Spring are the problems of templates only more so - if I were to make a spectrum I'd have Struts (and Tapestry) at one end, Wicket (and hiccup) at the other, and traditional templates somewhere in the middle.

[masklinn]

> You don't get that clear correspondence if you can have logic in your templates

You absolutely do.

> I don't understand your position at all. The problems of Struts and Spring are the problems of templates only more so - if I were to make a spectrum I'd have Struts (and Tapestry) at one end, Wicket (and hiccup) at the other, and traditional templates somewhere in the middle.

The struts I got to use was full of "smart JSP custom tags" because "components are the right way" and subclasses all the things, it looked exactly like the examples I see of Wicket: keep bouncing through layers and files of useless nonsense because all the logic has to be out of the markup but all of the markup has to be out of the code, and formatting a list takes you through 3 templates and 5 classes.

> Wicket (and hiccup) at the other, and traditional templates somewhere in the middle.

That makes no sense whatsoever. Wicket and hiccup have nothing in common.

[lmm]

> The struts I got to use was full of "smart JSP custom tags"

Which is very much the opposite of how Wicket does things: there are no custom tags, the templates are inert HTML and there's a very small, non-customizable set of wicket tags/attributes (IMO the right way to do it is just IDs).

> That makes no sense whatsoever. Wicket and hiccup have nothing in common.

What they have in common is that all your logic is in code, not markup.