[newdude116]

Turkey does not have the expertise nor money to build this.

Drones, they were merely assembling them from suppliers, e.g. https://www.trtworld.com/turkey/suspending-drone-supply-to-t... or https://hetq.am/en/article/126227

I doubt that Turkey won three wars with drones, as mentioned in the thread here. But they helped at least win one battle (Azerbaijan).

Turkey is of tremendous geo-strategical importance but lacks technology, oil/gas and money.

- Big importer of Energy

- Huge trade balance deficit

- Currency in free-fall

Recep Tayyip Erdogan’s image and Turkey’s economy are both taking a battering

https://www.economist.com/europe/2021/07/08/recep-tayyip-erd...

I think Erdo should focus on other things than trying to rebuild the Ottoman Empire.

[mrtksn]

Oh that's "Apple doesn't do anything, even the screens are from Samsung" argument. I'm not going to drill on that but I think you are underestimating Turkey's capabilities.

Erdogan is just one dictator that is in free fall just like the economy he created. He probably wouldn't be around as a politician in few years.

Despite its troubles, Turkey is still a very rich and capable country. It does have an established manufacturing industry with expertise in many areas including aviation.

Thanks to the rise of anti-immigration sentiment and xenophobia in the west, Turkey's talent pool is not draining as fast as it could have.

Because of the lira going down to the drain, an Engineer in Turkey costs $800 to $3000 a month, depending on the seniority. Housing, food etc everything is also cheeper.

Turkey's GINI coefficient is horrible, which means the country does actually has capital concentration. The nationalistic sentiment and culturally obedient population makes it much more sustainable to spend money on military projects.

What Turkey lacks is advanced electronics but they are working on it. For example, the Canadian IR camera sensor that they no longer want to sell is to be replaced with indigenous one. Unfortunately, that one will be heavier and larger which would probably affect other aspects of the drones in question - like range and speed, probably.

[christophilus]

We hired a Turkish software engineer recently, pay him a bit less than our American counterparts (which is a very good deal for someone in Turkey), and are very happy with the arrangement. He’s fantastic.

If you’re looking for remote engineers, don’t overlook Turkey.

[cblconfederate]

has really turkey been spared from brain drain ? There are millions in germany and other european countries and i d wager they face much less hurdles than most other middleastern immigrants

[mrtksn]

The ones in Germany are different than the recent immigration. After the WW2 Germany required workforce and hundreds of thousands of Turks enlisted, other immigrated due to political reasons. The inventors of the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine are the children of Turkish workers who made Germany their home.

The more recent immigration to EU, UK and the USA tends to be among the much more highly skilled.

The brain drain of Turkey is at all times high. Doctors, software developers, Engineers are fleeing in thousands. What I meant was, it could have been worse.

[newdude116]

"are the children of Turkish workers who made Germany their home."

Since Erdogan never claimed this as a "Turkish invention" nor talked in the news about it, I suspect the guy not to be Turkish but to be Kurdish. :-)

[mclightning]

You're incorrect, I don't know if the guy is Kurdish. But Turkey and Erdogan himself is very proud of the Turkish couple*.

He has taken stage in Turkey on TV alongside with Erdogan to outline the delivery of vaccines to Turkey several times.

[sdiq]

Turkey seem to be slowly replacing China in some parts of Africa - well, at least in Kenya and Somalia - as the source of most non-electronics merchandise sold from clothing to furniture. This is just from my observation with no proper sampling done. It also seem to be replacing India as a destination of affordable quality healthcare though at a much slower pace per my observation and mostly among Somalis not so much among Kenyans.

[baybal2]

> What Turkey lacks is advanced electronics but they are working on it. For example, the Canadian IR camera sensor that they no longer want to sell is to be replaced with indigenous one. Unfortunately, that one will be heavier and larger which would probably affect other aspects of the drones in question - like range and speed, probably.

The point that Turkey doesn't have the technological capability sounds silly. Just look at number, Turkey is one of the biggest engineering powers out there, in rank with Koreans, and Japanese, and sometimes ahead of them when it comes to conventional heavy industry, and civil engineering.

Turkey has tons of engineers, and engineering companies. That's the hard fact.

[newdude116]

Please enlighten us, what parts of the drone are Turkish https://tekdeeps.com/armenia-fixes-the-turkish-uavs-bayrakta...

"Thanks to the rise of anti-immigration sentiment and xenophobia in the west"

How about Turkish Xeonophobia? https://www.arabnews.com/node/1623171/middle-east

"Because of the lira going down to the drain"

Poverty in Turkey https://www.al-monitor.com/originals/2021/06/official-data-l....

Erdo had a run during his first two terms. Economic growth was tremendous. But he should have retired then. Trying to build a new ottoman empire, rejecting democracy and changing what made Turkey more successful than most Arabic countries - the strict separation of religion and state -, will end badly.

[mrtksn]

>Please enlighten us, what parts of the drone are Turkish

The design is Turkish, the software is Turkish and some parts are Turkish others are from suppliers from all over the world. If that's not clear enough, ask yourself what makes iPhone an American product. It's the IP, Suppliers can change.

That's why other countries are buying it from Turkey instead of ordering the parts from Alibaba and assemble. Why do you think that Armenians couldn't assemble their own "Turkish UAV" and use them against Azerbaijan? Didn't have screwdrivers to put together the parts?

About the whatabautism part of your question, Turks are indeed quite xenophobic. Yet, hosting so many refugees that makes about %5 to %10 of the country's population. If the USA hosted that many refugees, their number would have been from 16 million to 32 million. Turks are not happy about that, the latest polls show that about %80 of the Turks want the refugees gone.

Turks are not any less xenophobic that the Western nations, happy about that? The US elected Trump to get rid of the immigrants, EU got to the brink of collapse at the first million of Syrian. Turks might not be less xenophobic from the Westerners but they are resilient enough to take one for the team.

The poverty in Turkey has become rampant, the country does have a large number of poor people and rich people, the middle class with similar buying power to the western middle class has evaporated. So what? That's why Erdogan would be gone in a year or two. Erdogan is not taking the drones with him.

[newdude116]

" ask yourself what makes iPhone an American product. "

That it was designed in the US and the product parts are build based on specifications developed by apple.

If an Italian buys a Mercedes and puts a Porsche engine in it, you may call it an "Italian car" but there is much less know how in it than is required to develop a car.

"Suppliers can change." For complex items there are often few suppliers in the world. For some items there may be even only one.

International Innovation Index - Large and small country ranking https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Innovation_Index Turkey ranks position 58

[petre]

I wouldn't underestimate or dismiss them. This is what happened with China, they were making ball point pens in the 80s and then after 40 years they sent a rover to Mars and threaten their neighbours in the South China Sea.

Turkey is involved in wars all over North Africa and the Caucaz region. They're paying for mercenaries fighting in Libya and are suplying one side with drones. They supplied Azerbaidjan with drones and mercenaries.

[newdude116]

Turkey is a Muslim country. The strict separation of religion and state was introduced by Ataturk and is reversed by Erdogan.

While being a Muslim country is not necessary something bad, it seems to go not well along with an industrialized open society:

http://www.martin-van-creveld.com/monsters-ii/

I just came back from a short visit to Turkey and some strange, random impressions gave me big doubts.

[petre]

Don't equate Turks to Arabs. These guys do have a Turkish Hyundai, Ottocar and their country is quite well industrialized. Also, China is industrialized but not open, which is no reason to dismiss it, as it's currently exerting its influence in SE Asia and also worldwide to some degree. One of Erdogan's ambitions seems to be a new Ottoman Empire, something which does not fare well with Greece, the Balkans, most of Noth Africa and some countries in the Caucaz Region. That's also one of the reason Turkish attempts to join the EU will be met with opposition by Greece, Balkan EU states, along with Romania, Hungary. Here's a map for reference:

https://cdn.britannica.com/89/4789-050-B6176F52/Expansion-Ot...

[dragonwriter]

> Turkey does not have the expertise nor money to build this.

Heck, its pretty much what the US didn't have the combination of expertise and money to carry out with the UCLASS project, whose requirements got signficantly relaxed into an unmanned tanker with minimal combat capability project (CBARS) and produced the Boeing MQ-25.

[aaaxyz]

You could argue that 2 of these wars (as well as the standoffs in the Mediterranean with the Greek navy) are aiming to remediate the oil/gas problem.