| I agree with you about Play, it seems encouraging though I haven't used it for anything other than the tutorials on the site. Still not sure I'd want to use it over Rails or Python. I'm worried that people will think I'm a broken record on the topic of java, but this discussion is coming up a lot these days, and I think a lot of people are doing a mental re-evaluation of Java. One thing that comes up a lot is that Java itself isn't terrible, but J2EE (as well as Spring and other frameworks many developers consider over-complicated) has made the experience of being a java developer (especially someone new to the environment) unpleasant. While some people mention frameworks like Play, I'm interested in what people think of going back to the Servlet + Libraries approach that was common in 2004, just before Struts/Spring hit the scene. It's verbose, and I'm not saying we should just go back to the way things were, but I think developers might want to embrace the low levelness and verboseness of Java. My take on it is - if I'm happy to work within the conventions of a framework, then I'd probably be happy with Rails or Django. If I want to write Java, then I probably want a very detailed level of control over my code base. In this case, it might make sense to start with the bare-bones (servlets and jdbc), and grow into what I think I need through libraries rather than an over-arching framework like Spring. In general, I think I would want to use MVC and DI, but I'd like these things to be as unobtrusive as possible, and easy to add or remove, like libraries rather than something that dominates my code from the very beginning... Honestly, my thoughts aren't completely formed on this yet... I just find it interesting how so many people on HN are starting to discuss this now. Often, there's a reason that developers start to focus on a particular issue at the same time. |