[philliphaydon]

> I terms of providing value to the world at large they should have gone with Wozniak.

In theory yes, but it also could have tanked Apple resulting in Jobs/Woz going elsewhere and Apple never becoming what it's become, never pushing Mobile, Music, thinner / better quality laptops, etc.

I think in the ideal world we would have a balance between Job's vision and Woz's vision. Having that highly profitable company but the hackable open world.

(if that makes sense)

[christophilus]

We don’t know what we would have had. I could imagine Apple having solved the aesthetics while also keeping it hackable. My guess is they’d have come up with a LEGO-like approach to internals, using crazy materials science to find some way to get the blocks thin and strong.

[sokoloff]

I can just as easily imagine Apple failing to remain an independent going concern through some of its trough periods in the inevitable cycles that companies go through. As a user and an engineer, I’m 100% Woz, but I think Woz without Jobs probably doesn’t give us the Apple of today (just as much as the converse is also true).

[kmeisthax]

...so like the 2019 Mac Pro?

[elevaet]

The move towards mobile, music, thinner seems an inevitable progression in this vein of technology - analogous to transistor miniaturization that occurs no matter who the players are.

The build quality is something we have to credit Apple for though, not to be taken for granted.

It does seem like there's a sweet spot in a balance towards Woz's vision of hackability.

[philliphaydon]

> The move towards mobile, music, thinner seems an inevitable progression in this vein of technology - analogous to transistor miniaturization that occurs no matter who the players are.

iPhone was a first of it's kind. We had smart phones, we had touch screens, but Apple pushed the boundary. Everyone followed.

We had mp3 players, we had mp3 players that played video, (I had a Creative Zen), but Apple pushed the boundary with iPod's high capacity and ease of use. Everyone... Apple stole the market on this one.

We had laptops, decent looking ones, thin...ish... ones, etc, but Apple pushed the boundary with the Macbook Air. Everyone followed.

Apple is great at Marketing, Build Quality, and User Experience. (doesn't matter who disagrees with the last one, its a fact when a non-tech savvy person can pick up an iPhone and use it, but struggles with Android)

I don't think Apple is much of an 'inventor' company, but they do take existing things and make them better or push them in ways others can't or didn't think were possible.

----

In terms of the laptop market, I feel Lenovo is the /only/ company thats close to Right to Repair. Pretty much all of their laptops can be opened up and you can swap ram, memory, and ssd's. Their much older laptops back around like T440 you could replace the CPU.

But if any part of the laptop breaks, you can order any part.

I bought a Lenovo Legion 5 Pro for my wife, but in Singapore we can't get the keyboard with Traditional Chinese, can only get it in Taiwan or Hong Kong...

No worries

https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/sg/en/products/laptops-and-netb...

Navigate to Lenovo website, find the part number, contact the local distributor in Singapore, they have ordered the part for me and just waiting for it to arrive.

Bought a 4k screen and think damn I wish I had the 1080p screen instead...

https://pcsupport.lenovo.com/sg/en/products/laptops-and-netb...

Can find the 1080p screen for my thinkpad and replace it myself...

----

I do wish we lived in a more Woz world where more companies had parts you can buy and fix yourself etc.

[elevaet]

> iPhone was a first of it's kind. We had smart phones, we had touch screens, but Apple pushed the boundary. Everyone followed.

I agree that Apple took the lead, pushed the boundary, and that everyone else followed. But I think it was an inevitable evolution in the tech. In the absence of Apple, another company would have carried the torch, maybe 6 months later, maybe a couple of years later. But it was going to happen regardless.