[zepto]

This kind of stuff is silly and damaging propaganda. It distracts people from what being a billionaire means.

If Elon cashed out his stock he would no longer have control of SpaceX and Tesla. Those are literally what he is doing with his money.

[schmudde]

Agreed. It doesn't mean buying things, it means exercising disproportionate influence and solidifying a dangerous concentration of power. But the ability to secure countless of dollars in government subsidies - over and over again at every level of government - is pretty hard to illustrate. Let's hope this person's next project does a better job at capturing what being a billionaire means.

[zepto]

What disproportionate influence or dangerous concentration of power does Elon represent other than the power he has to motivate his employees to build rockets and cars?

[schmudde]

I guess all I can do is grant you the fact that political science has had a difficult time proving the impact of money on policy in representative democracies.

But I also know it is not an accident that someone as wealthy as Elon Musk paid no federal income taxes in 2018 and pays very little in many years. As wealthy people concentrate more power, they bend the system to their favor - distorting both social systems and the markets.

[zepto]

> wealthy as Elon Musk paid no federal income taxes in 2018 and pays very little in many years.

What has this to do with anything? He doesn’t live off a salary, so of course he doesn’t pay income tax.

[schmudde]

Exactly. This is how the system works. It is not an accident that someone can accumulate wealth and find ways not evade taxation through measures not available to other people in society. Even if you consider Musk's "effective tax rate," it's a pittance.

Every single metric shows that the wealthy are increasingly effective at concentrating their wealth. This has been the trend in the United States since the mid-20th century. It's undeniable that they are deliberately and effectively doing this. The only question is whether or not this concentration of wealth is good for society or bad for society. Due to the complexity of societies, this is difficult to demonstrate empirically. I grant you this.

If you think that these conditions haven't generally lead to the formation of strong kleptocracies throughout history... well I guess we'll simply disagree.

[zepto]

> Exactly. This is how the system works

Ok but now you’re agreeing with me. This has nothing to do with Elon musk exerting undue influence or doing anything nefarious with his power.

The system has worked effectively to enable someone who is capable of it to organize people to build spacecraft and electric cars.

> If you think that these conditions haven't generally lead to the formation of strong kleptocracies throughout history...

You keep ‘granting me’ that there is no evidence that there is anything bad about what he is doing, but then introducing new innuendo to that effect.

[zepto]

> I can do is grant you the fact that political science has had a difficult time proving the impact of money on policy in representative democracies.

Perhaps because it’s not as strong an effect as people would like to believe.

Wouldn’t you say political activists have a disproportionate influence on our democracies too? Why is that ok and the influence of billionaires not?

[msftie]

Agreed. We should all take being a billionaire more seriously.

[alisonkisk]

That's not true. He can sell at least half if not more while retaining voting control.

[zepto]

That’s not true - he has outside investors already.