[bena]

You know how they want that enforced. They don't.

She's talking about making taxation voluntary.

Which seems on the wrong side of crackpot to me.

Of course anyone who goes on and on about "the threat of violence" when talking about taxes is not going to discuss the issue in good faith. "Building libraries by gunpoint" is a thought terminating cliche. They're a brand of libertarian that elevates the very concept of being required to do something they don't want to as violence against them.

They are exhausting to deal with.

Taxes are the dues you pay to live in the community you stay.

There's a lot the government should stay out of, but there's also a lot the government should be doing as well. And as long as the government should be doing things, it'll need money to do those things.

[throwawayboise]

So don't pay your taxes and refuse to leave your property. Sooner or later, men with guns will show up.

[bena]

Don't pay your mortgage/rent and that will also happen.

Because that's what happens when owe money that you don't pay.

You chose where to live when you bought that property. That choosing is an implicit agreement with the government of that area to pay them taxes in exchange for certain services (schools, roads, police, fire, etc). And you are part of that choice whenever elections come up. Sure, you may vote 'No' on every tax increase, but that doesn't exempt you. Because, once again, as part of the agreement you implicitly made, you agreed to abide by the decision of the group in order to live in the area.

[AnimalMuppet]

> Because that's what happens when owe money that you don't pay.

When you owe money that you don't pay, and you refuse the normal first consequence (eviction).

[bena]

That applies to what the person I responded to as well. So my statement still is fine within that context.

Taxes aren't some special category of owed money that carries with it a unique consequence.

[WincysWife]

If you don't pay income taxes they might throw you in jail. No private debtor can do that.

[AnimalMuppet]

If you don't pay your mortgage, and you refuse to leave, they might still throw you in jail. Ditto if you don't pay your car loan, and you try to keep them from taking the car.

[dantheman]

Don't pay off the mob, and they show up because that what happens when you owe money that you don't pay.

[bena]

Equating the government with the mob and taxes with extortion are also thought terminating cliches.

Do you ever wonder why you have to make such hyperbolic analogies to even come close to a point?

[dantheman]

There are very few interactions where someone comes up to you without your consent and demands money at the threat of force. If anyone other than the government tries to do that we'd call it theft.

Look at how the Amish were able to opt out of social security.

[jdlshore]

I can’t agree. There are many interactions in which payment is expected, and, if not provided, you will be threatened with force. I.e., eating at a restaurant.

A lot of people decided, before you were born, that people living in your location would pay taxes. You or your parents chose for you to be subject to those rules when you moved there or were born. By continuing to live there, you subjected yourself to those rules. If you don’t agree, you can move somewhere else. However, part of those rules means you may have to give up something you value in exchange—citizenship, the right to vote on the rules, property, exit taxes, etc.

Unfortunately for you, there is no desirable place on this planet that doesn’t follow this “our land, our rules” approach. Most of them are very picky about who can be citizens. Luckily for you, you’re one of the privileged few who gets to live in one of the good places. (I presume, since you’re commenting here.)

You call taxes theft. I call NOT paying taxes theft—taking from the common good we and generations before us have all worked to establish.