[kemonocode]

> This is good for the planet because mountains of Xinjiang coal are no longer being burned to achieve literally nothing.

By the same token I could say all the power (and pollution!) used by the US military given that it's actively hostile to my country is a waste, bad for the planet and I wish it went away, but that wouldn't be too fair towards US citizens or their allies.

> But yes of course, this is good for Bitcoin. Everything is good for Bitcoin.

Well, Bitcoin is cleaner for now, wasn't that one of the greater criticisms levied towards it? I'm pretty sure by now that it could be found that mining Bitcoin cures cancer and AIDS by tomorrow and detractors would still find a reason to criticize it. I don't think there's a way to win, so I don't bother.

[arcticbull]

> By the same token I could say all the power (and pollution!) used by the US military given that it's actively hostile to my country is a waste, bad for the planet and I wish it went away, but that wouldn't be too fair towards US citizens or their allies.

You could make that claim, but of course, if the US military went away I suspect more than a few people would notice.

However, Bitcoin continued to work exactly as well without the extra hash rate. No byzantine generals were harmed in this hash draw-down. As such, when I say it made no difference, I mean it.

Mining exhibits an un-damped positive runaway condition with respect to price, as price goes up it becomes more economical to mine. As such you can waste more power and add unnecessary extra hash capacity and make more money. Not just can, have to, as others do so, to avoid getting left behind. Full on prisoner's dilemma. When 70% of it disappears en masse, it makes no difference.

> Well, Bitcoin is cleaner for now, wasn't that one of the greater criticisms levied towards it?

For sure, but it won't last, that's kind of my point.

The criticism is that it's roughly speaking the least efficient system humanity has ever implemented. Moving a mountain with a spoon is likely more thermally efficient. That hasn't changed, really, it's fundamental to the model.

[rantwasp]

> The criticism is that it's roughly speaking the least efficient system humanity has ever implemented.

Maybe, but setting bitcoin aside for a moment, the blockchain and the distributed trust is a revolutionary technology.

Imagine people complaining about how much cars pollute and how we should stick with horses. Are you willing to give up your car and everything that has an internal combustion engine?

[HappySweeney]

The US Navy ensures the world's shipping lanes are free from piracy. Without this, our imports would be much more expensive. Someone with better math skills than me could verify this, but I imagine this endevor is net profitable.

[rantwasp]

cost of something != it’s environmental impact.

so you would have more expensive imports, maybe. and you would move to produce things locally. also, the cheap imports are cheap because there is a human price (ie basically slavery) paid at the origin. if you produced things ethically they would be more expensive rendering the navy useless as you would once again shift to producing locally.

also, since when does the us navy provide this service? i mean maybe it provides it, but i have a hard time believing it protects all the shipping lanes all the time (ie other nations surely protect their trading routes)

[HappySweeney]

It's only the international lanes, and since the '50's iirc, but can't look that up atm.