[yenwel]

Well isn't the point of ubi that people less people could work. Productivity with automation has never been higher and we still work ourselves to death for less pay. We need to take the path of increased automation anyway since we've got some sort of ubi for the elderly population already. Now it's a burden for the young people. If we could automate a lot of basic needs like food production and processing, construction, transport etc you would have unlimited near costless basic needs met and provide for the elderly. Then it would just be panem et circenses but a bit more advanced and without the slavery and the need for empire building like the romans but just technological advancement and automation.

[josephcsible]

Yes, if we could automate away all of our low-skill jobs, then UBI would make more sense. But we haven't done that yet, so it doesn't yet.

[Qwertious]

You've got it backwards - low-skill jobs are done manually because low-skill labour is cheap. Low-skill labour is cheap because most people in it literally can't afford to not work.

We don't need to automate away all our low-skill jobs: we could just pay the workers more. Most workers are paid well below the actual value of their productivity because they have a crappy BATNA, and there's no need for employers to pay much higher than the worker's BATNA.

The more you pay the workers, the more profit in a machine that can replace min-wage workers, and the sooner a machine will be cheaper than the well-paid workers.

You've got it backwards.

[turbinerneiter]

There is an argument that low wages hold automation back by reducing cost pressure to automate, therefore UBI, since it would increase the cost of low-skill workers, would spur automation in that sector.

I think it's a simple, logical argument, but I'm not sure if it would survive a collision with reality^^

[schmorptron]

At the risk of sounding dumb: I agree fully with UBI and automating away menial jobs that don't bring people fulfillment. But what happens once we've done that? Do the top .1% just own all of the automation equipment and thus most of the industries? Do we need some way to commoditize that aspect then, (seize the means of automation?)? It's super hard to wrap one's head around this future where we have the challenge of preventing a few very rich from owning literally everything IMO