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by user3939382 1834 days ago
Is it my imagination, or do the offerings from Square and Stripe continue to converge?
4 comments

(I work at Stripe.) The offerings are meant for different use-cases. Stripe Terminal’s great for developers looking to deploy in-person payments at tech-forward companies. Square’s great for coffee shops and other SMBs!
More like Stripe is helping developers create the next Shopify :)

The true lesson here is that the bulk of value can be found at the point of the transaction.

What's stopping from coffee shops and SMBs from using Stripe? Why shouldn't they?
They'll have to build their own app and the rest of the checkout system themselves.
Nothing. It’s an insurgent tactic. Payment is being reinvented and developers are at the forefront, so enable them.
>great for developers

I'm guessing this means that the setup process of stripe terminal isn't to the point where a non-developer can plug it in and go. Square is great because anybody competent enough to install an app on their phone can use it

They also don’t come with Point-of-Sale software. Square is all-inclusive while Stripe is DIY.
The whole point of sale system.
I was curious and look up Square, they dont tend to go on news headline as much as stripe in tech circle.

I didn't know they went IPO, and they have a market cap of ~$100B. Wow.

It shouldn’t be surprising. That’s how you steal customers.
I’m not in the payment space, but it seems like it’s rapidly commodifying. The hardware to support mag stripe, contactless, and EMV isn’t terribly expensive per unit, and as long as there’s some bare minimum functionality, the competitive edge is the processing cost.

This seems less about stealing customers and more about keeping Stripe attractive to existing customers who might be continually evaluating other payment providers and their hardware offerings.

Long term, we likely end up like China with WeChat and Alipay, using apps and QR codes primarily for payments eventually. Venmo and PayPal support C2C and C2B payments with QR codes, Zelle is beta testing them currently.

https://www.paymentsjournal.com/how-wechat-alipay-networks-m...

Gravity Payments, First Data Merchant Services (the direct sales side of First Data), Vantiv/Mercury and numerous other platforms and platform resellers (Square & Stripe resell others processing platforms) have spent the last decade driving down prices.

Some wholesale contracts for certain ISO resellers are as low as 1 basis point (.01% of a transaction) and $0.01 for bank underwriting (where the bank holds the chargeback risk if the underwritten business goes bankrupt), with platform fees being as low as 3 basis points and $0.02 cents.

Stripe is probably doing the underwriting in house, hence why sometimes deposits of recent transactions to your bank account are delayed for a few days to a week.

Square & Stripe don't seem to be reselling other processing platforms.

> We work directly with multiple networks

https://squareup.com/us/en/payments/payment-platform

> Stripe’s platform connects directly to Visa, Mastercard, American Express, Discover, JCB, and China Union Pay across global markets

https://stripe.com/newsroom/news/direct-platform

In the merchant processing industry, there are frontends (where your transaction initially is routed for approval by Visa/MasterCard/American Express/Discover or by one of the Debit Networks) and backends (where the amounts of these transactions are debited between banks).

Square and Stripe are both Independent Sales Organizations riding atop Chase Paymentech and First Data respectively: https://www.quora.com/What-payment-processor-do-Braintree-St...

Stripe does use Wells Fargo for the backend settlement, they are one of the most popular acquiring banks on First Data (though many other banks can be used for underwriting risk and settlement of payments on First Data).

Interestingly Square basically created this category (the merchant aggregator) by somewhat secretly running all their early clients' payments through a single merchant account.
Don't you need to be a bank to settle funds from issuing banks? That's not what I interpreted you meaning when you said "platform reseller" for processing.

I believe Square is a bank now, so maybe they'll stop using Chase.

There's certainly a lot going on now.

Having previously implemented a variety of other payment providers, I am now looking at a Gravity Payment integration.

Not done yet, but so far pleasantly surprised by how they communicate with integrators.

Beware, Gravity screwed over numerous businesses I work with. They purposefully misclassified businesses SICs (a code that defines what very specific category your business is, eg: a bar or a restaurant) to reduce credit card processing fees (interchange fees) for their customers, but were caught doing this for a massive number of businesses.

The card networks and issuing banks that had this money stolen from them went after the businesses that dodged these fees illicitly, with bills of tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of dollars for fees that should have been paid.

huh, that's unexpected.

Thanks for the warning, I'll pass it along.

Surprisingly they have not encroached much on each other’s business, particularly Square moving very slowly into card-not-present.
Square's 3.5% + $0.30 transaction fee for card not present transactions is significantly higher than Stripe's 2.9% + $0.30 transaction fee.
Not sure where that pricing comes from. I believe Square's payments API is priced the same as Stripe (I'm sure that's not an accident):

https://squareup.com/us/en/townsquare/payment-api

> Square’s payment APIs are free to integrate into your software. For online sales, the only cost is 2.9% + 30¢ per payment transaction. Sales made with Square’s POS app are charged at our standard fees: 2.6% + 10¢ per swipe, chip card dip, or NFC payment. Manually entered transactions are charged at 3.5% + 15¢.