[ASalazarMX]

> I think Java fits better as an introductory language

Oh no, for a beginner just setting up the environment is a huge hurdle. Sun's Java downloads page is utterly confusing, and the IDEs are monstrous and complex too. Past that, they have to learn about the JVM and compiling to JARs before they can even run their first program. Leave all that housekeeping to us seasoned, soul-crushed developers ;)

If we're starting to teach compiled, boilerplate-ridden laguages to beginners, why not jump straight to C++ or Rust?

[kaba0]

Sun’s download page?? Also, vim is more than enough for beginners and there is hardly anything hard in javac Main.java && java Main. With a modern JDK java Main.java will compile and run it in one go even. Jars are absolutely not required.

[ASalazarMX]

Oracle! I guess I showed my age, and that the last time I developed on Java I had to use Eclipse and I still have PTSD from it.