[onetimemanytime]

OK, in theory you are right. But I doubt the average citizen lost from that. Did those guys win elections or just stole them /took power by gun to loot the country?

[MrsPeaches]

Patrice Lumumba [1] won an election and was removed and assassinated by the US and Belgian governments.

They replaced him with Mobutu Sese Seko a kleptocratic and murderous dictator, whom they supported for most of his reign.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrice_Lumumba

[2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobutu_Sese_Seko

[elefanten]

We’ve lost the plot here. Lumumba assassination was in 1960... 60 years ago. Since then, China had a Cultural Revolution, murdered their own people in Tiananmen, taken over by force and oppression in Tibet, Xinjiang and Hong Kong.

If we are comparing the character and proposed world order of China vs. US (or whoever else), we should be focused on the present: that which is actually on the table to choose between.

[0dayz]

Maybe read your sources before posting:

"The report concluded that Belgium had not ordered Lumumba's assassination"

And

"In 2013, the U.S. State Department admitted that President Eisenhower authorized the murder of Lumumba.

However, documents released in 2017 revealed that an American role in Lumumba's murder was only under consideration by the CIA.

CIA Chief Allan Dulles had allocated $100,000 to accomplish the act, but the plan was not carried out."

[MrsPeaches]

It does also say:

"In the early 21st century, writer Ludo De Witte found written orders from the Belgian government that had requested Lumumba's execution, and documents on various arrangements, such as death squads"

I realise that this may be a bit of confirmation bias on my side, regarding which of these I believe.

[Dah00n]

That...is a very racist view of African governments.

[ReptileMan]

Sorry. Saying that region is a mess full with strongmans, dictators and other unsavory people on top is not racist.

North of Africa is a mess. A lot of Sub-Saharan is ruled by strongmen. And even the places where there is actually democracy the state apparatus usually tries to rig elections in favor of current rulers.

Both by territory and population I am willing to bet that the people that live in countries with free and fair elections with peaceful transitions between administrations are a minority.

[andrepd]

Are you serious?? You doubt that the "average citizen" lost out from having their resources plundered / dissidents murdered / genocides committed / food siphoned out during famines / outstandingly successful land reforms overturned because US companies wanted to hoard land ...

It's staggering how insulting your comment is. How would you feel if somebody invaded your country, dismantled your government, decided who got to rule you, and told you it was all for the best and you probably didn't even lose out. Would you like it?