[kuroguro]

Only pointing out that there's no meaningful convo to be had at hardware/micro level. IMO there is no free will there.

Free will only becomes important on a personal (I do x because it's meaningful to me) or social contexts (I'm responsible for consequences of x action).

I doubt the philosophers are trying to say anything about our day to day lives and that's where most of the opposition is coming from (ie no free will, therefore no meaning in life or responsibilities for anyone).

[_y5hn]

This is why the body-mind is said to be the vehicle of the soul. These are all very ancient ideas, determinism especially.

As you suspect, people discussing this misses out on how it's all relative, not so absolute.

[kuroguro]

Well, I still don't think there's any souls/free will etc in the academic or "objective world" that is provably out there.

However I don't think we're living there. We live in our own minds with a limited view and understanding, mostly dealing with social problems day to day, and emotions coloring that view however they see fit.

So IMO the "soul" and "free will" (or whatever other beliefs one may have) are ultimately metaphors for navigating the complex inner world. They can be very important/useful for the individual and society yet non-existent in the "objective world".

[_y5hn]

Fair enough. It is just a word preventing people from turning us into soylent green willy-nilly.

To me there's no contradiction.

There are knows: We have shared lucid experiences and we can share contemplations of such.

There are unknowns: What is consciousness, what happens exactly in brain in relation to outside (body, family, room, house, area, town).

It all seems interconnected to the point of break-down when not, for minds especially.

[mensetmanusman]

I’m glad your will has an opinion. This all seems miraculous.