[marakv2]

Really what did JavaScript bring us? (And there goes my points!)

I want to search for information and share information with people.

I don't want any more from the net. It feels like what we want is being surpassed by those who want to monetise us.

[vicda]

Lightweight sandboxed applications in the browser. No admin password needed since there's nothing to install.

Sure it may be bloated overkill for something that could have just been a plain text file, but it is nice to have real time and interactive visualizations.

Plus it is nice to have the choice to use mobile websites instead of using the access hungry native apps.

[admax88q]

Figma, docs, sheets. All great apps I can use for any device with a web browser. No install needed, no updates needed. Easy to collaborate with. No "install this application" just "open this url"

Application delivery though the web browser is just hella convenient. It's really hard to give that up for some "native apps and static documents" utopian dream.

[CaptArmchair]

The idea of "web applications" is almost as old as the Web itself. Java Web Applets, Flash, Silverlight,... were all attempts to bring application functionality to the browser. Billions have been invested in this strategy.

Why?

Because desktop computing used to be a battlegrounds for commercial vendors in the late 20th century, and the goal was establishing market dominance. Being able to control who can run what on a platform was / still is part and parcel towards establishing that goal.

Web browsers changed the game. They are a threat and an opportunity at the same time. A threat because gave anyone a chance to escape from a native context and run whatever you want in a browser regardless of the platform your on. No more having to compile and distribute the same application for a dozen potential targets.

Microsoft was so adamant on having Explorer bundled with their OS in order to establish control over the future evolution of web applications on the information highway. And they got famously burned for it in that 1999 anti-trust case.

Application delivery as you know it today is convenient, but that came at a price. Vast amounts of resources have been poured into Chromium over the past two decades to bring that experience to billions. And it didn't happen out of sheer altruism on the part of Google.

[admax88q]

The fact that web applications are so old indicates the demand for such a delivery platform.

> Microsoft was so adamant on having Explorer bundled with their OS in order to establish control over the future evolution of web applications on the information highway. And they got famously burned for it in that 1999 anti-trust case.

Totally. Microsoft was using it to try control the web as a Microsoft platform. Hence their push for ActiveX over flash/applets/javascript.

> Vast amounts of resources have been poured into Chromium over the past two decades to bring that experience to billions. And it didn't happen out of sheer altruism on the part of Google.

At the time Chrome was started it was a more or less altruistic move from Google, from the user's perspective at least. Google was heavily reliant on the web for income and existing browser were slow, had widely varying standard support, and lots of security issues. Chrome forced their hands, by showing that a web browser can be fast and "secure."

Also at the time Google have a significant platform of their own. They would be at the mercy of the platform gatekeepers. So pushing an open platform that anyone can publish on was in their own interest.

Since then Android has taken off and Chrome has morphed into arguable spyware, but at its inception it was a good thing for users.

> Application delivery as you know it today is convenient, but that came at a price.

A price to whom though. To those who would try to lock down our platforms and seek rent over application delivery? I guess I don't really care about how much it costs them ;).

[speedgoose]

You can disable JavaScript by default for some time and then look at the list of websites and apps where you enabled it again. It has been a very frustrating experience to me.

[marakv2]

It's quite maddening. The only thing I've done with JavaScript is tracking customers, even if they sent logged in.

Now I'm a very unique slice, I only take quick contracts from upwork and such as I don't have the pedigree to get a proper job in coding.

[GoblinSlayer]

Your frustrating experience was before you disabled javascript or after?

[speedgoose]

After. Almost everything is broken. Keeping JavaScript enabled with a privacy/ads blocker is better for me.