[tomger]

Your definition of design here is limited to graphic design.

For many, design also refers to how a product solves a people problem, how does it affect people’s lives, what’s it worth ...

People who practice (product) design spend time looking at usage data, talking to people and understanding what the impact of a design change is.

I think most will agree those are essential things for a product to be successful.

[tluyben2]

Well, the GP is talking margins and branding. That sounds like graphic design to me.

But it does also apply to your definition somewhat though: if we were marketing forcefed a solution which made (possibly better designed per your definition) competitors die, is this excellent design (per your definition) or is everyone parotting eachother because they had enough cash to 'win the race' and are therefor the new standard? Which has nothing to do with design (even in your broader definition).

Ps. I do agree with you but very much feel that GP is mostly talking about graphical design, which I simply do not think is as important as designers think it is. Compared to most other aspects.

[tomger]

Indeed I don’t agree with GP’s pov that a clean graphical design is a major factor in the success of the products listed. I see it more as a side effect of a good team. That is to say, I would have less faith in a company that can’t get their process in shape to produce basic UI consistency for a consumer product.