[ircshotty]

Can't speak for Google's case - but Apple certainly goes to great pains to make it clear they don't collect location data on users - it's left on the user's device.

Isn't it interesting that it takes an international mega-corporation to take a more realistic and principled approach to user privacy than a democratic government.

[izacus]

> Can't speak for Google's case - but Apple certainly goes to great pains to make it clear they don't collect location data on users - it's left on the user's device.

This is not true at all - as the researcher from Trinity College found out a bit of time ago, Apple collects people location data even if they're not logged into the Apple account: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/03/android-sends-20x-mo...

It's very clearly marked as being collected, so I'm not sure why this myth of Apple not collecting data is being perpetuated. It's seriously misleading actual iOS users about their privacy.

[spacemanmatt]

If you're trying to make a case that Apple is my ally against government, I understand but disagree that Apple's privacy policy makes them my ally.

[dustinmoris]

Well put! These are the moments which everyone remembers and refers back to when the next troll comes along and claims that Apple must allow third party app stores.

[simion314]

People are not trolls to demand the freedom to do whatever they want with their property and the freedom to pass laws to force Apple to permit that. The argument that if you do not like Apple or Goole use Linux can be reverse and if Apple or Google does not like EU or other market with anti-competitive laws they are very,very free not to do business there.

Should I remind the fanboys again that Apple gives China direct access to users data? Apple does not have principles but PR people with spreadsheets, you as an user could use your brain and not install a government app or don't give it permissions but if you want the freedom to delegate your thinking to a for profit company you don't have to demand the others give up their freedom too (I don't need X so you should not have it either )

[dustinmoris]

> People are not trolls to demand the freedom to do whatever they want with their property

But you can do whatever you want as far as it’s possible by the product that you purchased. If you buy a Gameboy you wouldn’t sue Nintendo for not supporting you to play Playstation games on it, unless you’re a troll. Same thing for Apple products. Do with your iPhone what you want, but if you don’t like the Apple software on it then return your device or try to hack it or just buy another product which better meets your needs.

[simion314]

Sure, but I have the right to ask my government to pass new laws, so I don't beg Apple,Google, Facebook,Steam to be moral I ask my government to act for our common good and the giants are free to pack their bags and leave.

So when someone in EU asks for Apple to open up the US people should not trigger as much since they can keep their locked versions of the phones, nobody would force them to buy the unlocked EU version. Similar when banks were forced to reduce commissions on stuff, or mobile networks were forced to reduce big charges in EU the companies could ahve left, but the banks and companies are still here and not US citizen was directly harmed (maybe some will still cry that there are places where big money is not enough )

[dustinmoris]

> Sure, but I have the right to ask my government to pass new laws, so I don't beg Apple,Google, Facebook,Steam to be moral I ask my government to act for our common good

But the electorate didn’t ask the government to collect location data on them, quite the opposite, so everything that you just said is literally fantasy cuckoo land argumentation. The reality is that people don’t want to be spied in by the government and people don’t want Apple to give the government that access and Apple is acting in the interest of everyone except a few people in parliament.

[jmkerr]

The UK government has a democratic mandate to track infections, including by tracking visitors to areas of risk. The correct way to do this, and how most other governments do it is to provide two Apps. One for trivial QR/location based tracking, one for contact based tracking using the government-exclusive APIs.

The point is, the UK government made a technical error, we cannot extrapolate a democratic deficit or malice or anything like that from the information we have from this event.

[simion314]

I am arguing about the freedom to install what application you want, I don't demand you to install UK or other government app, if you would think for a moment this would mean that if your repressive government would force Apple to pre-install an app you would have the freedom to remove it(wow, to remove or change the defaults , such a revolution, think about it, and nobody forces you to do anything, you can keep all the Apple locks in place).

[cameronh90]

Apple definitely have a stronger case here, because as you say, they do more generally go to lengths to protect user privacy. That being said, they do use location-based advertising themselves.

[simion314]

Apple sent users data about what app their run and when they to their servers, and if I remember right the protocol was not secure enough. So either Apple does not care about privacy or they are incompetent not to implement that feature respecting the users privacy.