[onethought]

Sorry, your right:

- largest electric vehicle manufacturer and adoption

- 5G (still no SV grown solution there)

- Most advanced solar manufacture

- biggest investor in renewable energy and nuclear

- biggest investor in space based technology and delivery

If you’d like more I can keep going. I was responding to: “they steal everything”... I pointed out the most widely used social network that was homegrown and unique.

[astrange]

> - 5G (still no SV grown solution there)

Is this a real thing that anyone cares about? There was a lot of marketing from Samsung and Supermicro for a few months about how everyone needed "5G AI cloud infrastructure", but it seemed like an especially bad strain of bullshit. I certainly haven't figured out what it was supposed to mean yet.

Selling infrastructure to ISPs is not an amazingly high margin business.

[onethought]

Yeah, 5G is a real thing. It’s really fast and awesome!

It involves both improvements in hardware and software. Huawei are the leaders in it. (Devastating to the narrative that China just copies everyone)

[astrange]

5G FR2 is certainly fast but we already had "fast" (5Ghz Wi-Fi or wired Internet), and it's pretty harsh on mobile batteries. 5G FR1 is somewhat better than LTE but not really enough to enable new uses.

The real issue preventing new consumer uses is that wireless plans are expensive and have data limits. Driving that down presumably involves investing in the wireless ISP backend, which doesn't have much to do with the radio technology.

[inshadows]

Define awesome. How will it improve my life? Please don't mention high speed. Or if you do, mention applications where it makes difference.

[throwaway-8c93]

I do share your skepticism overall, 5G is being pushed more aggressively than its value would warrant. But there are parts of 5G suite that are indeed valuable and go beyond the mere "moar speed" mantra.

Network slicing is not consumer facing, but is a big deal in business-to-business connectivity, likely enabling business models that just aren't possible today. It's a bit like renting virtual machines in the cloud, but instead you're renting connectivity, tailored to your SLA needs.

Higher bandwidth, lower latency and lower power consumption are not exciting in isolation, but improving all of them at the same time does bring notably better user experience (see the raving reviews of M1 Mac for the same phenomenon).

[ubertoop]

This list includes no genuinely new innovations except for maybe 5G. You are listing that China is a major manufacturer, which is true. The OPs point was that China has a record of stealing IP from the US, which is also true. Listing manufacturers in China doesn't disprove this point.

So please, if you'd like, a list of genuine technologies who's origins can be traced to China... I'll be waiting.

[onethought]

So WeChat, and 5G. Should be discounted because they don’t support your point, and you will wait for others? Got it!

- Facial recognition on banking transactions.

- Tele Health rolled out via their ubiquitous home grown social network

- AI drones policing temperature and mask wearing

- real-time automatic translation hardware and software.

- Chinese based text input via keyboards

- Chinese voice recognition (a different problem to tonal languages)

By all means point out where they stole those things from

Then when you can’t do that, check out their space program, their capability easily surpasses NASA and is competitive with space X. Which given they are banned from even the iss where did they steal that from?

[ubertoop]

Most of the things you've listed here use WESTERN TECH just re-applied for a Chinese market, and you're calling that innovation? The fact that you had to list "Chinese based text input via keyboards" as a genuine Chinese innovation is telling.

Done with this discussion. You can't seem to come up with even 2 genuine Chinese innovations and instead refer to the reapplication of tech developed in the western world.

Nobody is saying China can't take what others have done and improve on it. That is happening more and more. It used to be China just straight up copied and stole intellectual property. I'll admit that line is beginning to blur. But genuine novel innovation is still very lacking.

[onethought]

I started with 5G. I know it's devastating to your case so you'll ignore it, but that is where I started.

The great firewall?

Social credit system?

Automated J-walking tickets based on facial recognition?

Tell me where those were copied from in the west.

Everyone just straight up and copies and steals intellectual property (Xerox, Apple, Windows)... But when china does, it's some how "china just steals everything".

Also there is piles of innovation in the "boring stuff" like "how to actually make a battery" or "smart phone manufacture" that is almost exclusively in Asia (and predominantly china). Or in BYDs case (the company that was making mass produced electric cars long before Tesla "innovated"), making batteries that are environmentally friendly when disposed of.

But hey, you're done with this discussion. So enjoy the blissful ignorance.

[ubertoop]

edit: forgot i was done. damnit.

From what I can find, 5G wasn't invented in China, nor was the concept of electromagnetic information transfer. Nor were transitors. Nor were micro processors. Nor were personal cell phones...

The list goes on, and it goes DEEP right down to the fundamental physics of these innovations which all did NOT come out of China.

Devistating as this all is to your point, you'll probably never accept it. China has a long history of stealing from the West, where the true innovation has occurred over the years.

Yes, I do think this is starting to change and I applaud China where it has introduced improvements to technology instead of raw copying (which it has a long, long history of doing). The unfortunate reality is that cheating for years has tainted their image, and try as you might to point out one or two examples of how it's changed, doesn't make it so.

[ubertoop]

Gosh, you know... I think you've left a very novel innovation from China off your list.

https://youtu.be/dnY2OtnTOcA