[syops]

In countries where gun ownership is hard to obtain legally criminals have much lower rates of gun ownership. Banning legal gun ownership does not prevent all criminals from accessing guns but it does prevent most of them from accessing guns. Importantly it prevents for the most part gun involvement in crimes of passion.

[notahacker]

Even more importantly, it discourages even habitual criminals from accessing and using guns. It is certainly possible to obtain black market handguns in the UK, but criminals know that (i) possessing them risks much more severe penalties, and convictions even if evidence of the other crimes they were involved with is inconclusive (ii) the risk of them being shot if not able to shoot someone disturbing their criminal activity first is usually negligible and (iii) more police resources are devoted to rumours of buying guns than rumours of selling drugs or other black market goods. So the average British burglar doesn't own a gun, the black market isn't a huge one and even many gangs that pride themselves on violence mostly or exclusively use less efficient weapons.

Of course, culture also plays a role: the UK never had many handguns or shootings before stricter regulations came in, and when they did gun owners generally complied.

[zepto]

In the UK, kitchen knives are used instead of guns.

Even Hip Hop in the UK glorifies stabbings instead of shootings.

[est31]

Even if the USA banned gun ownership, which would require a constitutional amendment and given views on the issue by majorities of the populations of some states, would thus be quite impossible, even then there would be the practical issue of enforcing that ban.

Immediately after the ban, there would still be gazillions of guns floating around the US. It would take multiple decades after the ban until the positive effects can be felt. During this time, the criminals would absolutely still have guns while the law abiding citizens would not.

Furthermore, there are huge smuggling activities at the US's southern border, making it possible for guns to enter on that route. Maybe if a strong border wall is built, it can be pulled off somehow.

Also don't forget that there are wild animals in many parts of the US, like say in Alaska. Sometimes you need to have a gun.

[_-david-_]

Not to mention the country would almost certainly split if guns were banned. I have zero doubt a large chunk of the states would secede so the ban would only effect states that don't leave.

[syops]

This is a different argument than the one I responded to. I gather then that you agree with me that the point I responded to is invalid.

[est31]

My point was that it takes decades until the point you responded to becomes invalid. Even if Biden banned all guns tomorrow, it's likely that criminals will keep having guns during the life span of everybody alive today.

[Ancapistani]

Further, if guns were banned tomorrow, there are a significant number of people who would instantly become criminals.

It feels like many who advocate banning guns severely underestimate the importance of the issue to the other side.

[nonbirithm]

Yes, it seems like the gun issue in the U.S. is cultural. You couldn't make the same arguments for gun ownership in the U.K. or Japan, because gun ownership was not as strong a part of the culture the whole period since their founding. It took two mass shootings in the span of a decade for the U.K. to ban almost all gun ownership.

I would prefer if nobody had guns (as an unrealistic utopian ideal), and if people were disincentized to obtain them illegally. But repealing the Second Amendment is both a lost cause and would do more harm than good. There is no undoing centuries of cultural propagation and convincing tens of millions of people who have already accepted the idea to cooperate.

If I wanted to minimize my chances of encountering gun violence as much as possible, I'd have to move overseas.

[hooande]

if guns are illegal their cost will go up. the cost of the weapon itself, plus the fee for smuggling obvious contraband. It will also be much easier to spot and arrest people carrying guns, as there will be no legal concealed carry permits. There are hundreds of millions of guns in the US, people will always be able to get them. but illegalization will make it more of a pain in the ass

The overwhelming majority of Americans, I'd guess over 90%, do not live in places where they need firearms to protect them from wild animals. Why should hundreds die from gun violence in cities every year because of the off chance that someone in Alaska will encounter a bear?