[find]

(I'm actually immigrating to Toronto later this year.)

I understand your frustrations over immigration policy, and it's certainly not racist to wish for Canadians to enjoy the fruits of Canada. I just want to gently bring up the historical context that you've left out, but of which you are likely aware. ~5% of Canadians are indigenous, and most humans in Canada descend from recent immigrants who came to pursue a higher standard of living. Barring other humans, born in a slightly different time and place, from that same pursuit: doesn't that seem to be in tension with history?

[dsomers]

Don’t listen to this guy. I’m Canadian and lived in Toronto for eight years. Toronto housing is expensive because of lax lending, bad zoning, and bad regulations. That’s it, Canadians are to blame for this. For an example Berlin is a similar physical size and population as Toronto, and has similar rate of high immigration, but has a lower cost of living relative to salaries. This is guy may not be racist, but he’s doing the classic lazy thing of blaming newcomers when its really the locals that did this to themselves.

[waterlooman]

I am blaming our immigration policy, not the "newcomers" as you say. Newcomers are obviously just doing what is best for them personally. Also, more than half of Germany's population rents housing. Most Canadians would not be satisfied with that.

[dsomers]

And your still wrong. Too much of Toronto is zoned for single family homes which is the main driver of lack of affordable housing. When you walk around midtown Berlin you don’t see any single detached houses with big front yards. What you see are mid rise apartment blocks that the city of Toronto literally makes illegal to build in large parts of the city. Then you have the federal government that has totally failed to pump the brakes on lending. This is 100% above bad planning by Canadians, stop blaming immigration it’s a lame cop out when the city only has a population density of about 4500 per sq km which is quite a bit on the low side for a major city. Look in the mirror.

[waterlooman]

Look you can use whatever mental gymnastics you like to insist why we should all be content living in tiny condos and literal commie blocks but as I stated nobody wants to live in that because we have better standards. People want affordable single homes to raise a family. The solution is so absurdly simple yet you grasp at straws to avoid it.

Population growth is too high to meet demand for proper housing. Therefor, the solution is you cut back immigration, within a couple years demand for housing will fall dramatically. But no, you don't want to see prices fall, or you have something to gain with the immigration rate being high.

[dsomers]

I suppose you don’t read anything about population demographics in Canada. If you did you’d realize we have a very low birth rate. Without immigration Ontario and Canada will fail, like Italy and Japan we’ll be stuck in economic stagnation and ever increasing debt load, until we can’t pay for basic social services or people are forced to work 80 hour weeks to get by.

When did your family come to Canada? Why do you think you should be the abetter of when it’s full? It’s been growing for 200 years and and at any point people could point to a Canadian city and say it’s full because that’s completely subjective in a country that could easily fit the world’s population.

You’re also completely missing the mark on what I’m saying a increasing density. I’m not talking about shoving people in tiny condos, I’m saying the housing that’s zoned for single detached houses should be zoned to be five story walk ups with beautiful courtyards like London, Paris, or the city I live in now, Amsterdam. These aren’t small condos, they’re large flats that families can live in, it’s not uncommon for families to have multiple floors. You know what people and kids do that don’t have back yards, they walk to a local park and interact with their community, and it make a much healthier and social community. Compared to most European capitals Toronto is a bland shithole, keep your ugly McMansion, keep your ugly car depended suburbs, keep your obesity, and bad food, keep your lame two weeks of vacation where you come to visit European cities you refuse to learn lessons from. Honestly get fucked, I’m over it, people like you are so ignorant it makes me never want to come back to Canada. There, are you happy, Toronto minus one person.

[waterlooman]

It is not a contradiction and it is not wrong for immigrants themselves to want to lobby for strict new limits on immigration numbers. The rest of your question/argument sounds like an appeal to emotion or guilt.