[DanBC]

Non invasive techniques are used -- people socially transition before they get access to hormones and surgery. For some people social transition is all they need, but ofr a small group of people hormones and surgery are life saving interventions.

[fock]

ok, but why are we talking about a lot of kids doing this then (with the technicality of just removing the hormons and not adding them). I don't think you can judge whether social transitioning works within a month or so?

Also: is there any indication that this is (in the sense that people need transition or otherwise kill themselves) is a problem in other societies than ours (or just with a bunch of apes). Because I still think that we should maybe change our society before we do hardly reversible things to people to make them fit in (very unpopular and quite influenced by conservative christianity (though I'm not affiliated))

[DanBC]

> but why are we talking about a lot of kids doing this then

Because you've been lied to. You've been duped by hate groups, and now you're happily spreading their disinfo.

> Also: is there any indication that this is (in the sense that people need transition or otherwise kill themselves) is a problem in other societies than ours (or just with a bunch of apes). Because I still think that we should maybe change our society before we do hardly reversible things to people to make them fit in (very unpopular and quite influenced by conservative christianity (though I'm not affiliated))

It's not a problem in other cultures because other cultures just let people transition. Without transition we do see increased rates of distress, including higher rates of attempted suicide and deaths by suicide.

[fock]

> You've been duped by hate groups, and now you're happily spreading their disinfo.

ok, this is three people in a very left-wing german publication: https://www.zeit.de/2020/22/transsexualitaet-lgtbq-geschlech... - one of them states that more people are coming to him. The intro states that the number in Sweden multiplied 15-fold. I'm sorry, but I miss the hate-group disinformation aspect here? (unless, everyone not agreeing with your PoV is a hate group. Which is interesting but in the past this behaviour usually led to violent conflict...)

> It's not a problem in other cultures because other cultures just let people transition.

oook. So which culture except Iran (which is certainly influenced by western capitalism) does/did this? To my knowledge the typical instruments of physical transition are only available in the western capitalism influenced sphere nowadays?

> Without transition we do see increased rates of distress, including higher rates of attempted suicide and deaths by suicide.

So, you for sure have numbers for that. But no, that can't be, because the number of people transitioning is constant!

[DanBC]

It's a mistake to think this is a left vs right thing.

Increased numbers of people seeking treatment just means more people understand gender incongruence and are prepared to seek treatment for it.

[fock]

great!

so let's subsume the results of my critical gender theory instructions today:

- hate groups are everywhere. everything which doesn't think physical intervention is the only solution is transphobic and you don't have to argue there.

- specifically: _every_ culture treats gender dysphoria by operating/hormones and the problem is not related to any social structures

- there is no increase in adolescents transitioning (despite publications and people who obviously are very transphilic saying otherwise) but we know that the rate of suicide is very high with people experiencing gender dysphoria. I wonder how you measure the last because if there's no change and everyone is oppressed by TERFs and the patriarchy I am not sure how you can reliably associate a constant rate of suicides to a specific condition.

If I look at this list, it looks awfully like the usual conspiracy theory, allowing me to assign the following properties:

- mental illness unrelated to the cause seems widespread between most modern "activists"

- most conspiracy theorists have no clue which actual kind of forces they and the society are subject to

- logic is the instrument of the powerful thus be done with it.

[DanBC]

I know you think you're making some amazing points here, but really you're just showing that you have no idea what modern science and medicine has to say about healthcare for trans people.

You're also saying stuff which I know can be sourced to organisations like LGB Alliance or the Heritage Foundation. You might not know that because, again, you don't know what you're talking about, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong.

In particular, you appear to be completely ignorant of the UK context and that's causing you to make a number of errors across your post. You're not interested in learning what those errors are nor correcting those errors because ... well, I'll let you complete that sentence.