[arbawk]

Bitcoin is the most durable money we've had, it can never be disposed of. Lost, perhaps.

Energy consumption != energy production. Bitcoin is incentivizing reusable energy and moving energy to cheaper locations, further from cities. I suggest you look into how it's actually quite positive for the Earth.

[leppr]

There's nothing about Bitcoin that incentives mining with green energy sources more than dirty one. If coal electricity is cheaper, then bitcoin incentives burning coal. The only somewhat valid rebutals to the energy consumption arguments I know of are:

- a lot of it is spare power that would be wasted otherwise (only partially true).

- it uses less energy overall than governments spend protecting their fiat money's value (not that comparable since fiat can also be used as currency).

- the gold industry uses a lot of energy too (but I doubt Bitcoin will reduce the energy spent on gold, it will probably just add up).

EDIT: completed gold mining point following comment

[Mikester]

> gold mining uses a lot of energy too (but I doubt Bitcoin will reduce the energy spent on gold mining, it will probably just add up

Why do people keep making the comparison to gold mining? It's inappropriate.

Gold mining is bad for the value of gold, because it increases the amount of gold in the world. Eventually, the gold coffers on Earth will deplete and there will be no more gold mining.

Bitcoin mining is necessary for the value of bitcoin, otherwise there can be no certainty of the blockchain. After most of the bitcoins get minted, the mining will still have to continue out of transaction fees.

The cost of mining bitcoin needs to be compared to the cost of gold storage and handling of gold transactions, not gold mining.

[leppr]

You're right, amended my comment. Doesn't change the argument though.

[Mikester]

It doesn't change your argument indeed, it helps it.

[cousin_it]

> gold mining uses a lot of energy too (but I doubt Bitcoin will reduce the energy spent on gold mining, it will probably just add up).

I'm not sure it will add up. It seems to me that different stores of value compete directly with each other, because you can store value one way or the other way.

[ARandumGuy]

You know we have a limited amount of green energy production right now, right? It's not exactly green if your bitcoin mining is using wind energy, while a bunch of other stuff is stuck with coal.

[chmod600]

The theory is that it provides demand for green energy, which will drive investment, technology, and expertise that can be used everywhere.

[SideburnsOfDoom]

We know that is "the theory"

We also know that this theory is really, really stupid: The kind of self-justifying idiocy that people don't come up with unless they're already deeply committed to a point of view come what may, logic and fact need not apply.

[user-the-name]

Are you really going to claim that there isn't a demand for green energy already?

[chmod600]

No, I didn't make any claim really.

I was going to add a disclaimer to my post along the lines of "not saying I believe or disbelieve this theory", but I was tired of adding disclaimers to all my posts.

[SideburnsOfDoom]

Are you not able to take a position on this asinine theory?

[mindcandy]

I'll take a position on this:

> Are you really going to claim that there isn't a demand for green energy already?

Is a disingenuous argument. Of course there is already demand for green energy. Meanwhile, Bitcoin increases the demand so much that people are apparently outraged by the increase.

[snicky]

So more demand for energy means more green energy? I don't quite get the logic.

[SideburnsOfDoom]

It's not actual logic, it's more of a rationalisation of the indefensible.

[mindcandy]

Supply follows demand is basic economics. Buy up green energy and the suppliers will use your money to build more supply in order to expand their operations to fit the larger market.

[chmod600]

"You know we have a limited amount of green energy production right now, right?"

It makes no sense to talk about something being limited "right now". Limits are about the future.

Can you please rephrase and clarify?

[jhoechtl]

But it will race to cheaper energy which means using sun and wind. And the enormous surplus generated is for the bono of all of those who don't mine.