[fivesixzero]

I’ve become a big fan of MikroTik routers and 10G/SFP+ router/switch hardware in the last few years. Their web UI and SSH console are a bit quirky but the performance is pretty great for the price.

My primary use case for their gear at home was to have a router that can handle a LACP WAN bond for my fancy cable modem as well as connecting to a 10G Ethernet switch via copper or direct-attached SFP+ to a CRS-305 10G switch. Their RB-4011 was a perfect fit, without any of the Ubiquiti SSO/controller stuff to worry about.

I haven’t explored their WiFi products yet (still using an old router as an AP) but their product range is pretty broad. Might look into it this year though.

[possibleworlds]

My primary use case for a home router is solid set and forget qos. fq_codel and cake were recently added to routeros v7 beta, which means I will be plugging in my hEX again after a few years of happy edgerouter x usage.

Also interested in what access points (besides unifi) people pair with mikrotik routers. Any wifi 6 recommendations?

[varenc]

The standalone Ubiquiti access points are still great IMHO. It's just their recent prosumer gateway/router product line that's really struggling. I've had a great experience with the older UAP-HD-PRO. Their newish $100 Wifi 6 U6-Lite AP is tempting but haven't tried it.

If you just need one AP you can set it up in standalone mode and forget about it. If you want more monitoring and control you'll need to have a Ubiquiti controller running to manage things. (can run one in docker, on a rasp pi, or just buy their "Cloud Key" product.)

[selectodude]

Their Edgerouter VyOS products are awesome too. I won't touch their Unifi stuff but I can't find anything that's even in the same price ballpark as the EdgeRouter 4.

[gcblkjaidfj]

> If you just need one AP you can set it up in standalone mode and forget about it

unless you need any feature besides wifi at all. then you need a controller and usg at all times.

[fivesixzero]

For awhile I was actually using a UniFi NanoHD for my AP. Performance and stability were great but running a Docker container for a Ubiquti Controller (for a single AP) was annoying enough for me to bail on it. My old Asus router with OpenWRT has been fine for now and doesn’t require me to run a container. :)

I’m still looking for a proper WiFi 6 replacement that can hook up to my 10G core, ideally via 2.5/5/10G copper or preferably SFP+ DAC. Nothing’s jumped out at me yet though.

[orisho]

If you just want dumb WiFi, you can provision and remove the controller. Nowadays you can even do this with the UniFi phone app (standalone mode let's you configure and update firmware).

I've had a UAP AC LR at home for a few years and we've got about 6 UAP AC HD at work. We used the phone app to provision and after that you can pretty much forget about it. Great for small startups that want great coverage and dont have someone who's supposed to mess around with it.

[colordrops]

I'm curious as to what you are doing with qos in a home setup.

[possibleworlds]

Late reply, and the other reply covered it really.

Up until around a year ago I was on adsl2 with a highly symmetrical connection. I work from home mostly as does my partner, with constant syncing to various cloud services plus large uploads and downloads for work.

Maxing out the puny 1Mb of upload would render the entire connection completely unusable. Yes, you can manually limit various apps but it so much easier just to throw an edgerouter x in front of everything running stock smart queue or cake.

I'm on a faster connection now so uploads are not so much an issue, but even still it works a treat for things like gaming / VOIP.

[supertrope]

Not have VoIP or gaming get disrupted whenever a large upload runs.

On my previous ISP latency would reach 2000+ ms when I let Dropbox sync or downloaded a huge file. Even web browsing would time out. I used Tomato to prioritize DNS, my VoIP analog telephone adapter, the first 256KB of any HTTP(S) connection, and some 27000+ ports used by games.

My current WAN connection reaches 300 ms without fq_codel enabled. With it enabled there's no jump in latency.

[phatfish]

Yes, I recommend MikroTik as well. Got two of their cAP wireless access points. All the features you would expect on enterprise level kit at 1/4 the price easily.

Because there are so many features the setup is not as easy as some alternatives I'm sure. But the value proposition is great.

Their "RouterOS" is standardised over pretty much all of their kit. So after you have worked it out once you should be set for anything else.

[wp381640]

One of the reason Uniquiti is so loved by techies is that you can recommend it to family/friends or set it and forget it for them (regular users also find the phone apps impressive and easy to use - it's an Apple like experience for network gear).

At this point there are probably 20+ home Unifi networks that i'm responsible for recommending or setting up, doing the same with MikroTik might turn me into a full time sysadmin :)

[floatboth]

> connecting to a 10G Ethernet switch via copper or direct-attached SFP+

> RB-4011 was a perfect fit

Huh, isn't RB4011 the one with the very weird "you can't use a DAC in the SFP+ port" limitation?

> haven’t explored their WiFi products yet

They seem extremely underwhelming, especially in terms of software support :(

https://help.mikrotik.com/docs/display/ROS/WifiWave2 — they're finally barely rolling out WPA3, MU-MIMO/beamforming, 802.11w — in an optional beta package for a beta version of the OS, currently on 4 devices, breaking 2.4ghz on one of them, and breaking CAPsMAN (centralized management).

[fivesixzero]

I had to get an active DAC cable (S+AO0005) for the RB-4011 because of the quirk you mentioned. Works great with the active cable, which was about $50 I think. I was glad I read the manual beforehand. :)

Thanks for the update on the WiFi side of things. Seems likely that I’ll be looking to another vendor for APs, but that’s fine.

[ahepp]

Do you know how ubiquiti's "edge" line compares to mikrotik?

[varenc]

Ubiquiti has a polished interface that's relatively simple to use for something with enterprise-ish level features. They also have some pretty good docs. For example, their article on the harms of Broadcast/Multicast packet storms [0] is useful even if you're not using their products. Same goes for the RF Antenna patterns docs [1].

That said, my next router/gateway won't be from Ubiquiti. Though I'll keep using UI access points for now.

[0] https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/115001529267-UniFi-Man...

[1] https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/115012664088-UniFi-Int...

[Lammy]

I'm a Mikrotik user, not a Ubiquiti user, but looks like the closest match would be Mikrotik's CRS (Cloud Router Switch) line. My home network is a CRS317-1G-16S+RM at the core and three CRS305-1G-4S+IN (one in each room), all running SwitchOS/SwOS instead of the stock RouterOS (they dual-boot, your choice), and I am very happy with them.

[varenc]

The Mikrotik CRS will work as a "gateway" right? That is, run a DHCP server, connect to my cable modem, provide local DNS, etc? Thanks!

[bombcar]

If you can run RouterOS (you can) you can do all that stuff - switchOS is much more like a bare-bones packet switcher; RouterOS is a full-fledged network OS.

Check https://mikrotik.com/software for some demos and stuff.

[Lammy]

Yep, that’s how they come by default, booting into RouterOS. I prefer my switches to just be switches, though, so I run SwOS and do all that service stuff jailed on a FreeBSD router PC.

[ethanpil]

What APs do you use with a MicroTik setup?

[Lammy]

I like Aruba Instant APs, the kind that don't require cloud management or a separate controller, though it seems they've folded the IAP line into the regular AP line or something with their new Wi-Fi 6 gear.

I'm still using Wi-Fi 5 because it's fast enough and cheaper. My central AP is a IAP-315, an IAP-305 in the garage, and another IAP-305 at the wall by the back yard. They're all PoE and linked with wired backbone to form a single big coverage area using a single elected IAP leader as controller for the rest.

You shouldn't have trouble buying grey-market ones as long as you are careful to stick to the same regulatory domain for all of them. Aruba gear is available as USA/FCC, Japan, Israel, and RW (Rest of World) versions. I have operated RW units in FCC territory (proooobably legally but probably not worth the risk) by setting them to "US Virgin Islands" so they match FCC-allowed frequencies and power limits, but linking more than one AP still requires the hardware to be same regulatory domain.

[gh02t]

Having owned several products from both, Mikrotik equivalents are generally way more feature packed but I find them hard to use. EdgeMax stuff is more polished, but has fewer features. Performance is comparable for the most part.

[Jiocus]

After having worked intensely with Ubiquiti Edge devices (their routers specifically), I'd recommend them time and again. Their Debian derivative EdgeOS is great to work with, both as an enabler for advanced administration, but also an approachable web ui (plausible to offload many issues to support desk without requiring insane amounts of dedication to the Craft).

For mad scientists though, the very open software stack is a good friend to have when 11th hour Requirements® dictate you must produce a rabbit without a hat, or rewrite your own domain-specific implementation to replace the Avahi service.

No experience with Mikrotic.

_On topic_: With cloud news like this, it's nice to know about the availability of Ubiquitis' Network Management System[1] which you can host and run wherever.

[1]: https://unms.com/

[dboreham]

MT radios are inferior to UBNT for some outdoor non-WiFi applications. 802.11ac vs the proprietary AirFiber. Agree that MT is often a better option for wired scenarios.

[aborsy]

Does it support Wireguard?

Also RouterOS does not seem open source.

[fivesixzero]

Sadly RouterOS isn’t open source. They’ve received a bit of flak for their “available on request” stance on getting GPL sources too. The fact that their GPL patches aren’t readily available is pretty uncool.

WireGuard isn’t supported on RouterOS 6, which is the current stable version, afaik. RouterOS 7 (currently available in beta) did support for WG in August though, as part of 7.1beta2 [1].

[1] https://mikrotik.com/download/changelogs/development-release...

[pabs3]

If you have any more details about the GPL issues with Mikrotik RouterOS, I recommend reporting them to the Linux developers via Software Freedom Conservancy, who have copyleft compliance projects:

https://sfconservancy.org/copyleft-compliance/#reporting

[pilsetnieks]

V7 supports Wireguard and UDP OVPN, it's in beta but reasonably stable, at least for home use.

[rhodozelia]

finally! been waiting for any UDP VPN from mikrotik since ... 2008?

[_joel]

I use a Microtik hAP AC (Small little SOHO style router with an sfp and PoE). You can easily flash it with OpenWRT and use wireguard on that. All open source too.

It's great hardware but I'm no personal fan of RouterOS.

[exikyut]

Huh. What's the experience like? Eg are there any driver issues, or edge cases with unimplemented/missing bits of functionality?

[_joel]

It's brilliant, everything works fine. I've even used the USB port with a smartphone for 4G backup tethering (just need to add relevant usb packages, the openwrt wiki details all this). Plus there's the luci web interface which runs like a charm. No complaints whatsoever.

[dboreham]

Although it isn't OSS, it's based on Linux and therefore semantically comprehensible by someone familiar with iptables, iptraf, etc. Unlike say IOS which will explode your brain.

[vetrom]

RouterOS is not, but Mikrotik added wireguard support to their firmware sometime in mid-late 2020. IDK if its out of beta yet.

[lillecarl]

No, still very shitty beta sadly. In mikrotik communities routeros7 is a meme (it'll never arrive). Even though its here, its not.

[yakkers]

A few months ago when ROS 7's first few public beta releases were out (and before then), I'd agree with you.

However, MikroTik seem to be making slow but steady progress with new features. Stability is still an issue to an extent, but for home use I could almost make the jump.

In fact, if I didn't use CAPsMAN to centrally control the multiple access points in my home, I would make the jump purely for fq_codel/cake AQM, Wireguard and WPA3.

[m463]

Mikrotik phones home too