[javaIsGreat]

I dont know anything about Lambda's failures to serve students other than most students are upset at paying for less than steller experiences (most of the other prestigious bootcamps share this), but my gut tells me I dont think they grew to fast, its just the calibur of student went down, i feel like the hot new bootcamp of the day is able to get really bright and/or qualified students. More average learners require more time and resources and the nonspecial sauce will NOT get them a dream job in less than a year which is the opposite of what all of the marketing leads u to beleive for all the bootcamps.

Lambda seems to have been trying to branch out to more normal learners.

Students that dont share those bright/already qualified credentials, do benifit a little bit of a "rub" effect by being associated with those bright/qualified students, and get to study/work with them during the course of the bootcamp so everyone wins in the short term. For average learners without significant backround IT knowledge or a prestigious degree, realistically they are going to need more than 3-6 months or a year to get a cushy programming job in the US (which seems to be what all of the bootcamps advertise they can offer students).

I consider myself an average/below average speed learner, took a bootcamp, i was surprised to learn the guy i was pair programming with had a CS degree from MIT lol. Some devs already had work programming experience, but most of us normies benifited by pairing with them and talking to them about problems/code/computers/study habits.

[908B64B197]

> I was surprised to learn the guy I was pair programming with had a CS degree from MIT lol.

That surprises me.

Someone who could drink from the firehose should not need some bootcamp to learn web dev.

[javaIsGreat]

I think some CS grads come out of school with a lack of practical framework knowledge, i mean like React or Ruby on Rails, rather than spend 5 months learning/building on their own, these top tier students choose to learn/build in a managed environment so it takes them 3 rather than 5 months. They are promised assistance with applying to jobs as well which can be a nerve wrecking process for a university grad. If you have the money and want to jump into the work force ASAP it makes sense to me.

The in person bootcamps ive found have had great community vibes to them. Fun being surrounded by fellow students/teachers, schools all have fun/studious/interesting faculty and students.

I taught the first few weeks of a FREE intro to software engineering bootcamp and had a few lower tier university CS grads who were happy with the curriculum/services rendered, they would just tune me out when i was covering something they already knew and would study/program while the less informed students would work through problems/Q/A with me.

[dragonwriter]

> They are promised assistance with applying to jobs as well which can be a nerve wrecking process for a university grad.

Universities tend to have career services offices that specialize in that and which are free for current students and at least recent alumni.

> If you have the money and want to jump into the work force ASAP it makes sense to me.

It's literally delaying entering the workforce, so it really doesn't make sense if you want to enter the workforce ASAP.

[908B64B197]

3 months to learn a framework?

I've seen web dev classes in colleges that are spread out on a semester where they basically learn whichever framework the university decided to teach. Doesn't take 3 months of full time work, more like 6 hours per week including labs.

I highly doubt someone from MIT CS would go that route and pay for a bootcamp, considering how easy it's for them to get internships at companies where they are going to learn it on the job anyways.

[javaIsGreat]

I agree that a CS from MIT surprised me,

Like i said, if you can spare the cash, and want to do a bootcamp, it might make sense for you,

I wouldnt discredit all of the bootcamps as useless money wasters, everyone has different goals/aspirations reasons for doing a bootcamp rather than jumping straight into the workforce. The MIT CS guy did end up getting a great dev job right out of the program.

[908B64B197]

> The MIT CS guy did end up getting a great dev job right out of the program.

I have no doubts he would. I'm doubting his very existence. Or, pretty sure he didn't pay retail on the bootcamp.

I think going from absolutely no code experience to 70K by doing a 6 months bootcamp is simply impossible. The many articles on lambda illustrate that.

For someone with a real CS or Engineering degree, I wouldn't waste any time or money on a bootcamp unless my employer was paying for it.

[javaIsGreat]

If you are accusing me of lying im not lol. I assume he got north of 125k for a top dev job not 70k

You could grow a lot as an engineer in three months in the right environment assuming a guided curriculum is able to channel your energies in the right places and teachers/fellow students are able to help as well. I imagine you could also be bored for 3 months, or overly stressed for 3 months, and have negative feelings in regards to that experience. Like most things in life, its not right for everyone and its not wrong for everyone.

I have lots of friends who've paid for coding bootcamps, most are rather content with the services provided. I know some students as well that feel they were swindled out of cash because they weren't able to get a top tier job right out of the program and resorted to previous career path that they were already unhappy with.

I think its great that the good bootcamps that show success are trying to branch out to more normal learners, not just the greatly gifted or qualified (like an Ivy league degree) few, it is a noble sign that these schools are trying to expand using their special sauce to help more averagely qualified student transition into professional software engineering. Ivy league schools, do not do this. They have hundreds of years of success and don't feel the need to teach more students every year. (in regards to their on campus facilities not online programs that clearly dont offer the same experience)

If Lambda or the other top tier bootcamps capped their programs at 10 students a year or cohort, all of whom had ivy degrees or significant personal experience, all of whom who would get jobs immediately out of school, they would better be able to keep their graduation rates/salary rates top notch, they wouldnt have any students complaining online,

I commend them for trying to expand and help more students, and im sure they will stumble and get better as time goes on.

None of the good bootcamp schools that I am aware of just ignore feedback, because they know students will stop going to the school if feedback is ignored as they dont have hundreds of millions of dollars in funding like universities do.