[programmerslave]

Not really. H1B immigrants raise the bar on hiring. Often times they are willing to work more hours, study more, etc for a chance to thrive in the USA. This reduces working conditions, effective wages, and employment prospects for Americans.

[nrmitchi]

> for a chance to thrive in the USA

Or, because they are forced to under threat of deportation. This is only the case because of the un-due power that the H1-B system gives the employer. This un-due power can easily be taken away (by not tying the status directly to the employer, and giving the employee the actual freedom to switch positions).

If the employer didn't have effective-deportation power over an employee, then maybe they wouldn't be able to get away with "reduce[d] working conditions, effective wages, and employment prospects for Americans".

The enemy here isn't the foreign worker. If you're upset with anyone in this situation it should be an employer that is taking advantage of everyone else involved, and managed to put the blame on someone else.

[safog]

This is just blaming immigrants for their work ethic. You can't keep up with people that work harder than you, don't disguise it as "un-due power employer has over employee".

The SWE market (where most H1s are employed) is so competitive that shmucks who run through 3 month bootcamps get 100k+ offers.

The threat of being fired is not as effective as you think it is.

[programmerslave]

Most undergrad computer science graduates cannot find jobs right now

[sjg007]

Unless they aren't being offered interviews, it's probably because they can't code. I don't mean that in a bad way but programming is not a skill that is emphasized in most undergrad CS programs.

It's kind of a catch22 but that's one reason we have these boot camps / tutorials etc...

[lazyasciiart]

Compared to normal years, my local impression is that kids about to graduate really aren't being offered interviews. And those who just finished a summer internship that would usually have led to a job offer mostly didn't get those job offers. It really sucks to be them.

[sjg007]

The normal path back in the day was QA first then dev. Sometimes you could jump the line via an internship but it was rare.

[safog]

This is true, but this is literally right now under exceptional circumstances (hiring freezes, reduced head counts etc. while COVID progresses). The last time this was true was after '08 - '10 or so.

I don't think grandparent comment is talking about the situation now, it was a more general comment about H1Bs under normal circumstances being forced to work long hours by employers under threat of job loss.

[reducesuffering]

> You can't keep up with people that work harder than you

Hmm. In history, I think this also applied to workers' advocacy of the 40 hour work week.

"Don't blame others you can't do your 70 hour work week. There's plenty of others we have to replace you if you won't."

Regulation was the developed world's answer to a race to the bottom.

[safog]

Your employer isn't forcing you to do 70hr weeks, plenty of people put in their 40hrs and go home and do just fine if that's what you wish.

The people who work 70hrs a week are people who are ambitious and want to get ahead in their careers - this isn't limited to immigrants in any way, plenty of Americans do this as well and you see this in other high paying fields - Law, Finance, Consulting, Medicine - for some reason programmers are the ones that complain despite being paid equally well.

[supercanuck]

You are kidding right? I managed interviews where the same person would perform the same interview with different names and you would interview a person and a different person would show up for work.

[supercanuck]

Same thing happening to migrants working farm fields in the USA.

[lovecg]

Well sure, all of this is true. But the other side of the coin is the myth of America built by scrappy immigrants. What country we want to be is probably at the core of this and many other issues. You can’t be both a worldwide magnet for hungry ambitious talent and an isolationist utopia with strong protections for local workers.

[damnyou]

So give out ten times as many green cards and remove the restrictions.

You don't want to do that? Oh, I see.