[AnthOlei]

I read your write up, but I’m not entirely clear on one part: how do cloudflare workers handle websocket connections? Are they automatically terminated after the worker spends too much time active? If so, doesn’t handling the WS handshake have a lot more overhead than a fetch call? Maybe I’m misunderstanding something here. One of my biggest issues with serverless is its inability to handle websockets in a sane way, so this would be huge.

[jkarneges]

My understanding is a Durable Object is similar to a long running JS app in a respawnable/relocatable container (imagine a Kubernetes deployment of 1 pod). There is always exactly one instance, somewhere. And because the instance is long running, WebSockets become more practical.

Note that because Durable Objects are long running computations, they are stateful and deployments are disruptive (clients disconnected). So even though you could potentially put them in the "serverless" category, the deployment experience isn't quite the same as short-lived serverless functions / lambdas.

The real novelty of Durable Objects appears to be their intended usage of fine granularity (and the underlying tech that enables this). For example, if you were building a chat room service, you could have 1 Durable Object per room. Of course, you could conceivably build a chat room service running 1 Node.js process per chat room on traditional VMs or containers, but that probably wouldn't scale well.

[kentonv]

Thanks, you explained it much better than I could.

[frakkingcylons]

I was struggling to wrap my head around Durable Objects, this was very useful.

[greg-m]

Hey, I'm the PM at Cloudflare for WebSockets on Workers. Support is still in beta, so we're still working through the timeout details here.

With the Workers Bundled plan (https://developers.cloudflare.com/workers/platform/pricing#b...), your WebSocket connection will stay open until your 50ms of CPU time expires. On Unbound (https://blog.cloudflare.com/introducing-workers-unbound/), which does not have a CPU time limit, your WebSocket connection will stay alive as long as it remains active and your Worker doesn't exceed its memory limits. If the connection goes idle, it may be terminated. We're currently considering an idle timeout on the order of 1-10 minutes.

[dwwoelfel]

I'm having some trouble understanding the pricing of Workers Unbound. How much would it cost to keep one websocket connection open for a month?

[kentonv]

We haven't published pricing for WebSockets yet. Obviously directly applying the Workers Unbound duration-based pricing wouldn't work very well; we'll figure out something better.

[kentonv]

WebSockets are a feature of Durable Objects.

Workers handle WebSockets in a pretty straightforward way. The server-side API is literally the same WebSocket JavaScript API as in browsers. sock.addEventListener("message", callback), etc.

But if you aren't using Durable Objects, then WebSockets on Workers aren't particularly useful, because there's no way to contact the specific Worker instance that is handling a particular client's WebSocket session, in order to send a message down.

Durable Objects fixes exactly that. Now you can have worker instances that are named, so you can call back to them.

Here's a complete demo that uses WebSockets to implement chat: https://github.com/cloudflare/workers-chat-demo/blob/main/ch...

> Are they automatically terminated after the worker spends too much time active?

We're still tweaking timeouts and limits, but in general you should be able to keep a WebSocket alive long-term, and reconnect any time it drops (which any WebSocket application has to do anyway, the internet being unreliable).

> If so, doesn’t handling the WS handshake have a lot more overhead than a fetch call?

Not sure what you mean here. A WS handshake in itself isn't terribly expensive. I suppose a typical application will have to establish some state after the socket opens, and that could be expensive, but it depends on the app.