[jawns]

Little theological tidbit here:

In Catholicism, there is a distinction between God's permissive will and God's active/perfect will.

God's permissive will is what God allows to happen, even if he does not desire it. God, for instance, gives us free will, which entails the ability to sin, but God does not desire that we sin.

God's active/perfect will is what he actually desires for us.

[ASalazarMX]

Counterpoint: since god is omniscient, he knows perfectly what his action or inaction will cause, present and future, from the subatomic level to the edge of the universe. A being like that can't possibly pretend to give humans free will, he knows exactly what they will do, we're like "PRINT HELLO WORLD" programs to him.

[jawns]

I took a philosophy of religion course as an undergrad that spent a long time exploring whether the concept of free will is compatible with an omniscient God. I really enjoyed it, even if it made my brain swirl a little. Here's a wikipedia page that sums up the problem: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_free_will

Obviously, there are plenty of theists, Christian or otherwise, who don't believe this to be a fatal argument, and you can find many of their viewpoints online. One such resource, from the Catholic Encyclopedia, is here: https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/06259a.htm

[ASalazarMX]

> Obviously, there are plenty of theists, Christian or otherwise, who don't believe this to be a fatal argument

Well, of course there are. We humans are flawed and will ignore what we don't like if that helps us believe we're right. This isn't a proof of truth, but of bias.

A religion course spending a long time trying to answer naturally a supernatural question is another proof of the great effort put into rationalizing fantastical beings. I doubt the question was answered satisfyingly, but even if it was, the next question is answering how Jehovah negotiates with the gods of other religions so humans keep their free will.

Edit: downvote instead of reply, that's precisely was I'm talking about.

[unimpossible]

That makes more sense. But I still don't see why the answer is to pray rather than exhort people to do something about it.

[dragonwriter]

> But I still don't see why the answer is to pray rather than exhort people to do something about it.

Asking people to pray is asking them to do something about it.

Not just in the trivial sense that prayer is an action (though that too), or that the specific prayer is asking God to do something (though, again, that too), but more deeply in the sense that prayer is, in Catholic thought, not a onidirectional communication but a dialogue, and praying for an intention is the beginning of discernment of what, if anything, God wants the praying person to do to serve others and make God’s will manifest in the area prayed for.

As for why he isn't exhorting more specific action, that's not what the venue of this call (the Worldwide Prayer Network) is for. The issues raised in that venue are often ones on which the Pope advocates more specific responses in other venues, though.

[ceceron]

Praying doesn't exclude a more "physical" action. When a catholic is praying for something, they should actively pursue the goal. The New Testament (James 2:14-26) states it explicitly. "Faith without deeds is dead" - praying is just one of many things people can do, sometimes the only thing.

[unimpossible]

Got it. Then it is a call to "concrete" action in some way. Thanks.

[marsrover]

Because most people can't exhort people to do anything about it. Don't quote me, but I imagine the majority of Pope Francis's followers are in third world or developing nations. Praying is all they can do to help.

That doesn't mean that Pope Francis shouldn't do something more concrete, and from the looks of this article, it seems like he's trying to.

> Earlier this year, the Vatican, along with Microsoft and IBM, endorsed the “Rome Call for AI Ethics” — a policy document containing six general principles that guide the deployment of artificial intelligence.

[im3w1l]

From a secular perspective, prayer is a way to align our conscious with our subconscious. The higher and lower order desires. The logical with the emotional. Prayer changes the world by changing the prayer.