[scsilver]

Yeah but what about the ones holding swastikas saying chanting "Blood and soil, Jews will not replace us" who were not condemned by the to of GOP leadership. The left uses their words like a shotgun, however, theres still nazis out there.

[koolba]

Not condemned? He literally used the phrase “condemned totally” referring to them. How much more condemned can you get?

Here’s a direct quote from Trump’s press conference:

> “It’s fine, you’re changing history, you’re changing culture, and you had people – and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists, because they should be condemned totally – but you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists, okay?”

It’s an outright lie to claim otherwise and the media was complicit in allowing Biden to do so. Over and over.

[scsilver]

The first statement said both sides, the second statement 2 days later tried to clarify the statement with an excuse that he was saying other people that walked amongst nazi were the good people. As a constant pattern of trumps presidency, he throws out a dog whistle and then walks it back 2 days later sayig he was taken out of context, misspoke, or was joking. You can claim he's fighting against antisemitism and racism, but I just straight up don't trust his good faith. My jewish eyes see him as supporting nazis and a supporter of those who walk with nazis. Him being a poor communicator is a lackluster excuse why I should trust him.

All those other good people walked under those nazi flags. Why would I trust them either?

[koolba]

> The first statement said both sides, the second statement 2 days later tried to clarify the statement with an excuse that he was saying other people that walked amongst nazi were the good people.

The first statement is in regards to people protesting to bring down monuments. There’s clearly two sides to that argument and there are many fine people, myself included, that do not want to see statues of Lincoln torn now.

> As a constant pattern of trumps presidency, he throws out a dog whistle and then walks it back 2 days later sayig he was taken out of context, misspoke, or was joking. You can claim he's fighting against antisemitism and racism, but I just straight up don't trust his good faith.

If your own biases interpret everything in some perverted negative light, then it’s an impossible standard to meet.

> My jewish eyes see him as supporting nazis and a supporter of those who walk with nazis.

And yet his grandchildren are Jewish and he’s had more success negotiating Middle East peace deals that benefit Israel than any other president.

If he’s Nazi supporter he’s doing a pretty crappy job at it.

> Him being a poor communicator is a lackluster excuse why I should trust him.

If you refuse to ever give the benefit of the doubt then why even argue about it?

> All those other good people walked under those nazi flags. Why would I trust them either?

Nobody says to trust them. But they’re not the only ones that wanted to preserve historic statues.

That’s like reducing all of recent racial / police protests to a bunch of looters robbing a Best Buy.

[fredophile]

> there are many fine people, myself included, that do not want to see statues of Lincoln torn now.

Who was trying to remove statues of Lincoln? In all the reporting I've seen on this issue I've only seen people trying to remove statues of Confederate generals and leaders. I, like many people, have no problem with these statues being moved into museums. They just shouldn't be public monuments.

[koolba]

> Who was trying to remove statues of Lincoln?

Both Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt statues were torn down: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/portland-protesters-tea...

Sure, you could say, “oh but that was two years later”. That’s not a coincidence, it’s the slope of the line when the left encourages an insurrection.

[fredophile]

I wasn't aware of that incident. This does appear to be a single isolated case and not a widespread issue.

> That’s not a coincidence, it’s the slope of the line when the left encourages an insurrection

I can see how you'd make a slippery slope argument here. However you're mixing it with some serious hyperbole that diminishes your argument. The left in the US isn't some homogenous, well organized group. You're taking millions of people, many of whom would not be consider "the left" in other countries, and lumping them all together. That's a huge oversimplification.

Can you show me where there are calls for insurrection? Most of the protests in the US in the last year that I'm aware of have been non-violent or were intended that way by their organizers. Some have had violence break out. While I'm sure some of the people involved have been on the far left wing you can't blame all of the violence on the left wing protesters[0][1].

[0] https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-race-and-ethnicity... [1] https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:bGtLQh...

[scsilver]

The question is why some on the left think they are fighting nazis. I think I answered my anectdotal view sufficiently. There are people out there at protests acting under the symbols of nazism and the chief executive charged with assuring those who are concerned fails again and again to ease that concern. Defend his actions all you want. The vote has come in, you can look at that for it's democratic feedback and mandate on preferred leadership.

[koolba]

> The question is why some on the left think they are fighting nazis.

Using the labeling of the opposition as Nazis as the proof that they are Nazis, is one hell of a circular argument.

[scsilver]

Ignoring the Nazi flags hanging over the argument is a questionable way to claim circular logic. People think they are Nazi, Nazi sympathizers, Nazi allies, because these people were standing beside Nazi flags, within the people yelling blood and soil, Jews will not replace us. There is a distinct start to the argument. Do you not care to recognize that?

[heavyset_go]

> Here’s a direct quote from Trump’s press conference:

That's a quote from August 15th. Trump had made statements about the murder in Charlottesville as early as August 12th, when he famously walked out of the interview after being asked to condemn white supremacists.

Please see my post here on HN about this incident[1]:

> You've linked to the second interview he gave about Charlottesville. In his first statements in an interview on August 12th, 2017, he famously didn't condemn white supremacists who murdered someone, saying instead that he condemns "egregious displays of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides, on many sides".

> Then, several days later in the second interview on August 15th that you linked to, he equates the violent white nationalists that murdered someone with what he calls the "alt-left", the purported group that the murder victim belonged to, saying that he thinks there is blame on both sides. After asking for further clarification, he says that there were fine people on both sides. Only after further questioning, and in a separate statement, does he condemn white supremacists.

> People were criticizing him for his initial equivocation on August 12th, comparing the white supremacists who murdered a person to the victims of their violence, and the fact that he didn't name or condemn white supremacists. In fact, when journalists asked him to condemn them, he walked away from the interview. He refused to differentiate between the two.

> Then, on August 15th, he defends his initial comments through his continued equivocations in the second interview.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25019361