[kgarten]

They discuss later Eric Weinstein’s claims towards Carol Greider. they also link to the uberfeminist. although I don’t like the tone, the analysis and take away seems sound.

Don’t care if somebody is awful or not, but care about if somebody can backup claims and Eric seems not able to.

http://uberfeminist.blogspot.com/2020/02/eric-weinstein-is-a...

http://uberfeminist.blogspot.com/2020/03/eric-weinsteins-con...

The uberfeminist seems quite obsessed with the Weinsteins. still the blogposts appear spot on in terms of reasoning.

If you find errors or proof for the claims the Weinsteins put out please post.

for me personally, the worst was when Eric Weinstein compared BLM protestors to the Reichskristallnacht (link bellow) ... then I just thought he has really no clue what he is talking about.

I’m happy to be proven wrong.

edit: typos

[graphov]

Well, I didn't find much analysis and arguments there. Most of the links to the twitter account of the same name doen't prove what they are claimed to prove.

Calling Bret "a known idiot" in the first sentence is 1. disgusting. 2. has no basis, he didn't say anything stupid there. Maybe lineage conflict isn't the best frame for looking at WWII, but one of the frames nonetheless and the rhetoric of Fatherland etc. indeed shows that.

The supposedly contradicting "claims to victimhood" there are actually not contradicting if you listen to the portal episode. The fact that the Weinsteins didn't provide evidence doesn't mean it is false or evidence doesn't exist. It's just not for podcast episode. At the end of that episode Eric invided Carol to come and respond on that podcast. Also, regarding "claims to victimhood", I haven't really heard this story from him before that podcast when Eric ensisted that he tells it. So Bret is by no means claiming any victimhood.

Re: BLM and Kristallhacht, you didnt' include the link.

[kgarten]

I meant further down on the page: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETcq7qqPhow

Sorry got confused ... the BLM thing was Bret not Eric.

As I said, I don't agree with the tone of uberfeminist. Yet, the blog posts have some valuable points (even though they attack the Weinsteins also personally).

Ok, if you claim sth, I just want to assess how much is true about it. In this case it's quite some claim. I just wonder, where is the evidence?

If Eric Weinstein can provide it, great. I will believe him . If he cannot, I wonder why he would mention these topics in a public podcast. Even if they are true, if you cannot at least provide some kind of evidence for them, they sound to me like conspiracy theories.

This is also not a singular incident in terms of just claiming sth. and not being able to back it up (COVID, 9/11 ... unity theory etc.). I mean he claims his family was kept from 3 nobel prices ... might well be, yet so far I find that far fetched. Just saying.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof ... no?

I'm skeptical and like to hear/see things for myself. The "I don't speak German" podcast really makes some impressions I had more concrete (also the episode with Becca Lewis). It seems for me the Weinstein brothers are just utterly confused.

[graphov]

Wait, I've listened to that piece and it doesn't mention broken glass there. Did I miss it? Do you have a timestamp? And I agree on all points that he makes. The only thing related to BLM protests is that he mentions some folks asking to kiss their shoes or asking others to knee, but even in those cases he is careful enough to clarify, that he doesn't thinke they are actually BLM protesters. And they are jerks for sure no matter what their skin color is.

Regarding evidence I have a couple of thoughts - I don't think the situation was such that required publishing the evidence. If Carol or someone else would question the claims, showing the evidence would be necessary. (I don't count uberfemenist allegations since they are utterly disrespectful). Moreover, even if Bret doesn't have the evidence (like for the conversation with Carol over the phone), it doesn't mean that he should never tell about the story. Obviously we don't have to believe it either. Moreover, my impression is that Bret himself isn't very willng to dig into this story, it is mostly Eric pushing him.

I don't quite get what other claims he isn't able to back up. What did he claim about covid or 9/11 that he wasnt' able to back up? I only saw him questioning the explanation give about one of the buildings collapse. By unity theory - do you mean his physics theory? Whell, I haven't paid attention to that, but I'm not sure how are you supposed to back it up? If it contradicts the observation/experiment, or is self-contradictory, it is bust, but what does it mean to "back it up"?

Where did he made the claim about 3 Nobel prizes? He said that Bret might have had one in the video that is linked multiple times from the uberfeminist blog, but I haven't actually heard about the other two.

p.s. it is quite tedious to type that much, if you want we can chat by voice/video, just drop me an email by appending gmail to my nickname.

[kgarten]

Sorry ... just got up. different time zone. Wrong link again (I’m on the smart phone as away from the laptop) https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PfAumoTIeik

Around the 9:45 mark.

[graphov]

Well, he was speaking about how a Jewish person feels seeing a lot of glass broken by a mob, I won't agrue with that although I personally wouldn't use this comparison.

Is it about BLM protests though? I personally make distinction between people who protest lawfully against police brutality and racism - and I think it is totally warranted and honorable, and people who set things on fire putting lives at risk, who attack police simply for being police, who harass strangers to rise their fist in "solidarity", who put graffiti suggesting killing cops and journalists, who march through resident neighbourhoods in the night shouting and shining flashlights in people windows, etc. For example these people:

https://twitter.com/PghAutonomy/status/1307166700916412419 https://twitter.com/historyoarmani2/status/13245641457532354... https://twitter.com/PNWYLF/status/1323893149081677825

For me this interview with a black police officer was quite revealing of the other side to the protest even before the real mayhem starts: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha-7SETmJD4

And on Kristallnacht, early in its history NSDAP didn't have their ideology formulated particularly clearly and were attracting all kinds of radicals and revolutionaries, hence "sozialistische" and "arbeiter" in its name.

[kgarten]

The video is about BLM ...

Lawful protest? When did lawful protests change anything? MLK or Gandhi? Their protests were not lawful and were also very violent (the violence coming mostly from one side). There were also riots and pundits on the streets with them ...

https://twitter.com/Trevornoah/status/1269291643842289666

Again, with the comparison to the Kristallnacht Eric makes a dangerous comparison as I explained it bellow in the thread already and he should know because he's Jewish. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kristallnacht

He insinuates (for me at least) 1. BLM (or those riots in case you want to not associate them with BLM ... which I think he does over the title) is just some kind of pretext for totalitarianism 2. authorities are standing back and let them riot. (because that's what Kristallnacht was... it was organised with the OK from the authorities)

I don't think it's his intention, yet can you see how this is dangerous? He gives militias a reason to go out and "defend" themselves against the authorities who are in on it (like during the Kristallnacht as this was state sanctioned) like the group that wanted to kidnap Gov. Whitmer or the shooter who killed people in Kenosha. Again, I'm not saying that this is his intention or that he thought about it, yet I could see crazy people saying "I heard, the riots are just like Kristallnacht." and using it as a defence for more organised violence.

Yes there are crazy Antifa twitter accounts, so what? I didn't see them try to kidnap a governor ...

If you tell me, as a German, that Kristallnacht is happening in your country, I would be ready to help you and up for a fight (definitely not non violent!!). I know Eric is not making that claim, yet I feel for somebody appearing smart and trying to be a public intellectual, it's a dangerous comparison. I can see how it can be misused.

What do you mean with the NSDAP ideology was not formulated particularly clearly? The heads of the movement had a clear vision (I mean one of them wrote a book about it released 10 years before the Kristallnacht ...antisemitism was at the core ... the Kristallnacht was horrifically well organised by the way). The "sozialistische" and "Arbeiter" had to be there as otherwise it would have been not possible to get a mass movement. Yet, the underlying ideology from the leaders was clear from the beginning (check the bios of the SA and NSDAP leaders you won't find any communists or socialists there).

[kgarten]

sorry, traveling right now, just phone with bad internet connection.

the 3 nobel prices: https://twitter.com/uberfeminist/status/1219421671305564160

[graphov]

To be precise, he says "there might be as many as three revolutionary nobel-quality ideas". And yes, their family indeed have a lot of brainpower, so I don't even see it as such a big exaggeration or boasting.

TBH all I see in this twitter account and the podcast is just crapping on people by nitpicking innocuous and respectful phrases or claims and trying to make them look like a proof of some grave moral fault. I don't really want to engate with this sort of content anymore, especially via my poor keyboard, sorry. And as another user wrote in the comment - why listen to this second hand stuff - just open The Portal or The Dark Horse podcasts and listen to the Weinsteins (and Heather) themselves - I GUARANTEE you, you'll learn much more than from those twitter accounts, especially if you have different opinions. On evolution, economics, physics, governance, and much much more.

But I'm still open to having a chat over voice/video, given how different our sources (and I guess opinions too) are we can have an interesting enriching conversation if we manage to have a respectfull constructive disagreement. Timezone-wise I'm in Europe.

[kgarten]

Sorry, don't agree with you on the brain power part. Can't see what they achieved or did in their perspective fields that's so great. I feel they are overselling themselves ... Compared also to other intellectuals I don't agree with (e.g. Pinker).

I would recommend you to listen a bit to Jeremy Scahill, and especially also Amy Goodman. She's an institution to me ... Just awesome work for all the years: https://www.democracynow.org/

https://theintercept.com/podcasts/intercepted/ The intercept got quite a bit heat recently, yet Jeremy is still just awesome (always to the point and careful in his analysis).

They are much more in line with my political bias. Yet honestly I find they make much more sense (and use a much more precise and easy to understand sentence structure/argumentation line).

[kgarten]

Sounds great. I'm a bit busy the next two weeks ... :S I'm in Asia Pacific right now. Will sent you a mail this week. Happy to talk to you.

I listened to Dark Horse a couple of times and really don't liked what I heard ... leading me also to post this podcast episode. Later, I was checking in with Majority Report. Most of the time Seder is unbearable to me, yet he makes some good points against the podcast and the IDW (Weinstein's, Harris etc.).

I grew up in the German hacker bubble. It's very positive about Antifa and generally anarchy, knowing my biases :)

Really like hackernews for the conversations here as well.

[graphov]

Also, ask yourself - is this uberfeminist account an honest inquiry into who Weinstein is and what his position is? Or is it a propaganda operation that aims to mislead you and distort your perception of him where the conclusion is known from the outset and all the activity is to try to prove it by whatever means? For me the answer is obviously the latter.