[throwawi]

Heterosexual male here. I think the last time I touched anyone was when I hugged my mom when she visited me 3 months ago, and before that I don't think I touched anyone for the 6 months since I broke up with my gf.

After finishing college I moved to basically the middle of nowhere for my tech job without knowing anyone in the area. Wasn't proactive enough making friends, and because of my gf at the time I didn't seek out any women. We broke up right as the pandemic started, which may have been the worst possible time.

I'm not sure if it's because it's been so long that I touched anyone, but I don't get touch deprived as often as I would have expected. Sure there are times occasionally where I feel really lonely, but so far it's been pretty easy to brush that off. However, taking care of my mental health has been nearly a full time job. I make sure to exercise daily, I picked up guitar and mountain biking, and I blocked all social media I see as toxic (reddit, youtube, facebook. HN is okay in moderation). I my sleep schedule in check with targeted melatonin and bluelight filters. Keeping up with old friends and family is also essential.

My running theory is that touch is certainly a positive, but it isn't essential if the other parts of your life are kept in shape. Although shortening that list of mental health tasks to something more manageable does sound enticing. I've never been good at dating though, and with the double whammy of it being quarantine and not having a local friend group I'm not really sure how to solve that problem. Dating advice might be a bit off topic for HN though, considering temporarily unblocking reddit.

[raducu]

My running theory is that western society is built around depriving men of certain emotions that say "you are good enough as you are and should be appreciated just as you are"; be that touch, sex (how many times have I heard this cultural fetish that men should transmute their sexual energy to something "better") .

Like cutting branches from a young tree so that it grows taller or straight -- to serve an ulterior purpose.

The ulterior purpose for cutting emotional branches of men is to increase productivity and yield from men, increase obedience to authority figures for fighting wars and so on.

[throw4reasons]

I coexist with my wife (and 3 year old) but we came to the conclusion that we are utterly incompatible and cooled off the romantic part completely. I hoped things would turn around but the pandemic and wfh exacerbated the problem. I only play with my child (+ the daily hug) but other than that I haven't touched anybody in more than a year and am somewhat somewhat fine with it. I am aware that I am not replacing the need for a partner with the affection for the child but simply accept the situation for now.

[raducu]

> but we came to the conclusion that we are utterly incompatible and cooled off the romantic part completely

> I hoped things would turn around

Tell your wife that.

I feel that I am also incompatible with my wife on an intellectual level, but I can manage many point aspects of our relationship.

One (very) good aspect of our relationship was sex. This has taken a downturn recently and somehow, either because my wife was implying it or some social expectation, I was left with the impression that somehow I was a pig that only wants sex.

A great insight came from a female therapist who told me that sex is also a way to communicate and regulate/re-establish relationships. I shared this insight with my wife who also found it very true.

I'm sure its not just the sex, but touch as well.

There is this modern myth that spouses should be perfect matches and its sort of all or nothing -- this is very wrong and damaging.

[germinalphrase]

For what it’s worth, my wife and I slipped into a similar pattern and it put a great deal of stress on our relationship. We did seek some outside support and things have since moved back in the other direction. No advice here. Just sharing to acknowledge that these things can be fluid.

[Juliate]

YMMV but on our side, at some point in our life, we resorted to decide on at least one mandatory full minute (60 secs) hug every morning and possibly anytime the other asks for it.

Just this, as small and simple as a one minute hug made a huge difference and generated other benefits.

[throw4reasons2]

Wow, this is almost my exact situation. I'm living for my child. I would have much preferred to demonstrate to him what a healthy, loving relationship looks like with my wife, but the status quo is probably the best that can be made of a bad situation.

[nradov]

Ironically, living for your child will probably produce the opposite of the effect you intend on your child.

[raducu]

No, it is not and you'll teach your child some very bad lessons for the future.

You should acknowledge and try to fulfill your emotional needs as well.

I had a REALLY bad example in my mother who changed her mind multiple times about divorcing my father for the sake of me and my sister. That mental model of self-sacrifice made me unable to breakup with my (now) wife after some major red flags.

If you want to re-connect with your wife, absolutely tell her that and acknowledge to yourself and her that you do have emotional/romantic needs, and that your child absolutely is a reason in your willingness to give your relationship another go, but you will not be forever happy or stay in this arrangement.

[twyayayayyaya]

This is likely a common and underreported experience right now. I'm in a similar boat. My partner of many years and I managed through most of the pandemic in a city then moved to another lovely small town. It was a couple weeks later that my partner confessed that they had cheated on me on a single drunken occasion a year and a half previously. I felt taken advantage of, almost kidnapped, that they hadn't thought to say this before. It's been a month and a half and we're in limbo, not together, but not separated. Roommates.

Per the article, my partner is absolutely one who desires the language of touch. That we are around each other but deprived of it is very taxing.

[giardini]

You should read the short article "Why You Should Forget the Past" by Rolf Dobelli at

http://meaningring.com/2016/03/07/why-you-should-forget-the-...

[saiya-jin]

OP's situation is more complex because of the child. We all know kids that grow up without father tend to have more often various issues in later life (I've seen folks like that everyday in pre-covid times, it becomes glaringly obvious once you know what to look for in their behavior).

But then also staying in cold detached relationship ain't the best for the child either - they are very perceptive and seeing everyday cold parents relationship affects them negatively too. There isn't a nice, quick and easy solution for everybody without some real chance of harm for the most vulnerable - that's why it often becomes one's low point of life. You know its bad for the person you love the most, and you don't have a clear win scenario. Amicable split with good care from both sides is probably best, but unfortunately rarely seen.

Fuck I wish we were taught more these kind of things in schools (selection of life partner is tricky, test the relationship and each other hard before having children, but also things like effective communication, teamwork, how to generally thrive in system - ie taxes, how to setup a 1-man company etc.). Imagine nation of people raised like that, instead of memorizing tons of stuff that was forgotten very quickly but spent a lot of time/energy on.

[pedrosorio]

> I've seen folks like that everyday in pre-covid times, it becomes glaringly obvious once you know what to look for in their behavior

I’m curious, what are the telltale signs?

[saiya-jin]

There are many, not 100% for this reason, but often are - unhealthy competitiveness, inability to be happy with what one currently has (clue - it won't get much better once more is achieved). Children from broken families often don't believe in long term relationships or starting family and come up with reasoning like overpopulation and actually doing good for mankind. General insecurities. Afraid of generally any commitment. Emotional intelligence on a low level.

There are more extreme cases - wife works currently as doctor in prison, and most folks there didn't have a good (or any) fatherly model. Women have their own 'daddy issues' side to it, but most above applies too (experienced first hand in one relationship, it was pure nightmare although she was smart and professionally successful).

[oarsinsync]

I grew up with loving parents and siblings, we're still a strong coherent family unit.

Unhealthy competitiveness, inability to be happy with what one currently has, don't believe in ... starting [a] family, these things all apply to me.

My parents will celebrate their 50th wedding anniversary next year. I distinctly recall my mother describing my father as her best friend about a decade ago when on the phone to one of her friends.

Suffice to say, I disagree with your theory of tell tale signs. You've just put people in a box incorrectly.

[reify_null]

Is this also different between growing up without a father vs growing up without a mother? I have some thoughts on this of my own, not sure how accurate they are.

I suspect the first case causes more competitiveness issues, general aggressiveness (or toxic masculinity if you will, though the term is somewhat problematic) The latter more issues with trusting women, intimacy, etc. Not believing in long term relationships might be more likely if one of the parents is completely out of the picture, not so much gender related. This is from a male perspective, perhaps from a female perspective the two cases can simply be flipped.

There probably is some research into these things, but I wouldn't know where to start.

[hackerfromthefu]

I recommend the book 'families and how to survive them' for some actual insights on this topic

[watwut]

Absolutely none. Kids who grow in families with issues have higher rates of issues. (And kid having issues tend to break family too).

But it is not glaringly obvious at all who grew up with missing dad (or missing mom). None of the issues the sibling mention are exclusive to such people nor so much more likely to be found in such people.

[AnIdiotOnTheNet]

It's funny how the exact problems you were unprepared to face in life are what you think should be taught in schools to the exclusions of other things.

[watwut]

Once you have child, you are forever tied together through child. If they divorce, he wont be with child every day. He will be with child either on alternating weeks or every other weekend or whatever custody they agree on.

And he will still have to cooperate with ex. (Through here it sounds like fairly doable.)

[adamsea]

Another possibility is you may not be aware of the impact of not having touch, if it is not something you regularly had.

[swiley]

>After finishing college I moved to basically the middle of nowhere

People keep talking about how leaving cities will be great but they haven't lived in rural places. It's not nice.