[Spooky23]

> Government is instituted no less for the protection of the property than of the persons of individuals.

Obviously there is nuance there as Madison and his constituents depended on the power of the state to deprive their laborers of their natural rights.

Madison in particular struggled with the notion of human chattel and the paradox of standing for liberty and slavery. He banished import of slaves and advocated for profound government intervention on the market — a federal buyout of slaves.

[IncRnd]

Madison may have been impure, but that is distinct from his thoughts on property being a right instead of a "function or construct of society, rather than a natural right in itself".

[DetroitThrow]

> Madison may have been impure, but that is distinct from his thoughts on property being a right instead of a "function or construct of society, rather than a natural right in itself".

To be clear for anyone else reading, Madison viewed personal property as a right, but private property as a social construct - there is no vagueness in his views.

Additional context provided here: https://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/CPP/FP_PS02w.pdf

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/taxation/publications/aba...

[IncRnd]

To anyone reading DetroitThrow's comment. Madison's own words delineate what he thought of property.:

" That is not a just government, nor is property secure under it, where the property which a man has in his personal safety and personal liberty, is violated by arbitrary seizures of one class of citizens for the service of the rest."

and Madison's closing words:

If the United States mean to obtain or deserve the full praise due to wise and just governments, they will equally respect the rights of property, and the property in rights: they will rival the government that most sacredly guards the former; and by repelling its example in violating the latter, will make themselves a pattern to that and all other governments.

~ https://thf_media.s3.amazonaws.com/CPP/FP_PS02w.pdf

~ Madison on Property

Madison viewed a just government as protector of private property.

[Spooky23]

I wouldn’t call him impure, merely a human who was a product his times with the intellect and courage to question.

The whole point of this thread is that regulation doesn’t equate to any meaningful definition of “communism”. Property has scope attached to it, and whatever right exists isn’t supreme over other natural rights, and just like say, speech, can be regulated.

Property's nature is shaped by society and law. My clothes and real property belong to me. But I do not own my children, and cannot buy the sky. I cannot own title to contraband. Also, The commons exist and must be protected against encroachment.

Also don’t forget that natural rights are not worth anything if I can acquire you as property. And the conditions that allow one human to own another are set by society.