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by stephc_int13 2093 days ago
The only hope I have about Swift is that Apple won't try to force every devs to use their language to release apps/games on their platforms.

For now it is possible to use standard API (C/C++, Posix, OpenGL, Vulkan)

But I have a bad feeling about this.
3 comments
zapzupnz 2093 days ago
In the 12 years since the App Store, we've seen a plethora of languages become available for iOS. Swift has existed for half that time, and even in the past 6 years, we've seen more languages, more frameworks, and a LOT more non-Cocoa apps.

Meanwhile, the majority of the system remains based on C, C++, and Objective-C (accessible via C) APIs, the same that many of the other languages and frameworks tap into to access Apple's higher level frameworks.

Why the sudden fear and trepidation?

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stephc_int13 2092 days ago
Because the more time passes the less trust I have in Apple.
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zapzupnz 2089 days ago
Bit of a vague cop out answer, to me. If there’s been any evidence that Apple would crack down on other languages and frameworks, sure, but as the exact contrary has proven to be the case, there doesn’t seem to be any legitimate case for concern.

Let’s end the FUD.

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kennywinker 2093 days ago
Apple has always taken a position something like "do it our way, or you're on your own" with their developer tools - but I don't see the situation getting any WORSE any time soon. Apple has so much code that's written in C, C++, or ObjC, that I don't imagine they'll ever be in a position to drop support for those languages. So as long as your language is able to interop with C/C++ or ObjC you're going to be fine.
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pjmlp 2093 days ago
Ironically that is how the game industry has evolved from Assembly, to C, to C++, to middleware using C# or Java,...

Via the languages forced into game devs from platform SDKs.

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stephc_int13 2093 days ago
Well.

C# and Java can be considered, at best, as branches in this evolution scheme.

C++ is by far the dominant language to create games today, and IMHO, for the foreseeable future.

Google tried to force every dev to use Java on Android for a while, but they finally and reluctantly added the NDK (C/C++) so that game devs would port their engines and games.

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pjmlp 2093 days ago
That is how C++ started to be used back in the 16 bit days.

Oh the arguments how it was an heresy to even think contaminating the source code with C++ constructs.

Track down any C vs C++ flamewar on Usenet back in those days.

NDK exists since Android 2.0, hardly anything new, as is currently more castrated than on those days.

It is impossible to create a production level game engine in Android without reaching out to Java, given the API surface.

Game devs will use whatever the platform owner puts them on the table, when the platform is enticing enough to refuse being part of the party.

Just like if enough Indies make money with HTML 5 games, some bigger studios will eventually suck it up and use JavaScript, WebGL, and whatever tooling targets WebAssembly.

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stephc_int13 2092 days ago
You are right to some extent.

But many game devs have the privilege of not being motivated by money before everything else.

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