[ascat]

How the empty seats of SC/ST in the IITS reflect that they are disadvantaged? They have much less cut off, many SC/ST give the exam, their fees is much much less than the general category, they get scholarships. How are they disadvantaged ?

[thewhitetulip]

My brother living in his hamlet has no electricity after 8pm, has 0 access to coaching and has little to no access to books or anything related.

This is circa 2000s though.

The village has affluent upper caste people while the lower caste people still do menial jobs

Reservations are meant for them. But the city folk who have the most knowledge and access to money abuse this system while real poor lower class people aren't able to access.

I knew of an economically backward class person who wore woodlnd shoes. My parents couldn't afford those shoes, his did yet he had woodland shoes.

Moral of the stort: city folk abuse reservation system caste or economic terms because it takes a 5k bribe to a local govt to fake your income certificate, lot of people I know have done it.

My dad worked in a govt firm, his colleague who earned the same money was lower class so his daughter who got marks exactly as same as mine got a stellar college and ANY branch she wanted, but I wasn't a girl & backward on paper so I had to settle for what I got

[kumarharsh]

True that the reservation system gets abused a lot in India. Living in North India, I frequently see rich families enjoying reservation benefits even when they don't need it. They don't realise they are eating up positions for the people who really need it. And the children of these rich families that the reserved seat as something they are entitled to and not affording any respect for the opportunity.

It's infuriating that reservations have become so abused, but any step by any party to change it would be met with such a fierce opposition that it's literally impossible to change.

[econcon]

Ofc here assumption being made is that college is the deciding factor of success later in life.

Most backward cast candidates will be unable to forge deeper connection with powerful ellite caste people and they'll suffer in networking/connection game.

Education is just one of the many factor, if you don't have connections - you can't get people to believe you or invest in your business, your paper degree isn't going to do much.

Historically, new connections (both social and business) were forged based on marriage which was limited to marrying within specific cast. As a result power accumulated through network effect in hands of a few.

No matter how much education you put in backward cast candidates they are not able to get inside "ellite" network of upper caste people.

I'll give you a counter example, one of my friend dropped out after highschool and another one (backward cast) got degree from IIT university.

Today highschool upper caste person has more wealth and married to a local celebrity while the backward one is at government office and he hates his job, only people he party with are people of his own communities. Many times he's not invited to the private parties by his bosses. On paper tho, you might envy his job but socially tho he's an outcast - it's not changing soon either. He himself acknowledged, he's only boss at work but outside work, no one gives him much respect.

[kamaal]

>>I knew of an economically backward class person who wore woodlnd shoes. My parents couldn't afford those shoes, his did yet he had woodland shoes.

Woodland shoes last years, in most cases the only reason you thrown them away because you are bored, they refuse to wear out no matter what you do with them.

I come from a fairly lower-middle class, poor background(Dad was a truck/bus/cab driver over years). I was donated used woodland shoes by a relative during my engineering days. I wore them for years, like even years after I had a job. And I used to walk kilometers during my college days every day.

If you are poor/lower mid income class student. Woodlands is some thing you should consider buying. Its really buy and forget. Also wear jeans, even if you buy cheap ones. I had a pair, I wore them so much the pockets started tearing out. Do this and you can go expense-less for years. This is my version of ramen profitability.

If you are thinking frugality invest in quality. Lower mid class students must invest in woodlands.

[thewhitetulip]

Well, poor people who have to choose between Food and Rent i.e. really economically backwards can't afford woodland shoes and a new fancy phone every other month!

Alao for that matter, Sparkx sandals and shoes too last years, much cheaper option..

[ascat]

I get what you are trying to say. But this is generally the story of every first generation learner, even if they aren't lower caste. I have seen these kind of situations all around me in the past, my dad only used to own a bicycle, worked hard, passed the exam (general category) and now have a decent house. Everybody who is economically is suffering but this doesn't mean that reservations are the only way/help to succeed

[srean]

There is also the effect of first generation learners. Many don't have the benefit of parents and family with a background in education who can mentor. That's quite a big deal.

[thewhitetulip]

I can attest to that personally. I am reasonably intelligent yet I absolutely flunked by IIT exams because of 0 guidance.

None of my family knew what IIT was and for some reason they chose not to send me to a big city for a decent coaching class