[fsloth]

I don't think you can secure a decent life by programming outside of US - if this is understood as position of comfortable financial independence.

I'm a programmer, my income is in the top 10th percentile, but that just means I'm in the upper middle class with the privilege to pay more taxes. I need to work until I get to retirement to secure myself financially.

[cmrdporcupine]

FWIW I think that's the same in the US as well, unless you strike it lucky with stock options. As obscene as Silicon Valley salaries are, it would take remarkable financial discipline to get to the point where an early retirement could be had.

I believe that due to market forces, engineering salaries are set as high as they can be without producing "escape velocity" for said engineers.

That said, I'm not in the US proper but in Canada, but I'm in the same position as you: highest tax band, make very good money, but unless I were to dump everything and move to an area with a much lower cost of living I will be in no position to retire before 65. Doing that (major cost of living reduction) becomes difficult once you have children.

[C1sc0cat]

Id agree but can we stop using "obscene" in this way and TBH a average SV salary is nothing much to write home about compared to some other professions.

[notacoward]

> I need to work until I get to retirement

That is true by definition. No matter how much or how little you make, it remains true. The question is: when do you get to retirement? Making a lot of money makes it a lot sooner.

[fsloth]

In my country I get to retirement when the government says I can go - more or less. Otherwise the pension is really small.

To explain: a large chunk of our salary goes to the state's pension fund - not my fund. When I reach the official retirement age the government will allow me a pension that is scaled based on my payments while employed.

At this time I'm looking at 3 decades on front of keyboard (am 40 and the official pension age for me will be around 70).

[TeMPOraL]

For now the "trick of the privileged" (like myself, I guess) is to work remotely for an US-based company and get half of US salary, while living in a country where that salary is still 2x what you'd get on your home market. It probably will stop working at some point (as salaries for remote workers reach equilibrium), but for now, it's a good way to live.

[fsloth]

Ok, I suppose in that case where you can get as remote a salary far exceeding local market rate the situation is also conducive to an early retirement :)

[burntoutfire]

It's very doable in Poland - see my comment above somewhere. At least for now, the taxes for contract work (even long-term one) are low and the pay puts you probably in 98-99th percentile in the country. Retiring in 10-20 years is real (of course, it requires full-blown careerism: job hopping, going after the hottest fields/fads etc.).