[jeanvaljean2463]

Not a scientist or doctor, but have taken a lot of time to understand how I can protect my family if needed.

Not picking a fight as I feel that evidence based analysis is paramount.

There are some good studies that show that HCQ+ ( HCQ with Azithromycin and Zinc ) is quite effective at PREVENTING serious outcomes in many cases as it seems to interfere with portions of the viral replication lifecycle. There haven't been large scale double-blind trials yet, but there should be. The few double-blind trials there have been have focused exclusively on HCQ without the additional viral inhibitors and were done at toxic doses when the virus had largely already replicated and the patients had progressed to a "serious illness" with the accompanied "cytokine storm". Lots of bad information out there, 'politically' deployed with little information behind it.

This isn't and shouldn't be the only treatment available, but we shouldn't discount things because they don't fit with our worldview or because our 'enemies' promote them. Facts are stubborn things. We should strive to do better collectively.

I'll leave speculation of motivations behind on why more types of treatments haven't been tried. We're in a strange time when a lot of the institutions that have failed the public are still being weaponized against people who desperately want the best outcome for folks.

[dguaraglia]

> I'll leave speculation of motivations behind on why more types of treatments haven't been tried. We're in a strange time when a lot of the institutions that have failed the public are still being weaponized against people who desperately want the best outcome for folks.

See, this is a complete misconception based on a conspiratorial mind. I'm not blaming you specifically for it - I used to think the same way myself - but it's something I've seen repeated over and over by people as if it's fact, when in reality there's plenty of proof it isn't.

For example, there's several trials being done on common anti-inflammatory drugs to prevent the cytokine storm [1]. Dexamethasone - a very cheap corticosteroid - has been found to be effective in reducing risk for people with severe cases [2]. There's a bunch of other almost over-the-counter drugs being trialed.

Are companies interested in making a ton of money by developing a new drug? Absolutely. But that doesn't mean the scientific community is just 'sitting this one out'.

[1] https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/04/417196/clinical-trial-test...

[2] https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2021436

[jeanvaljean2463]

Thanks for responding, I had seen dexamthasone as a post-treatment for serious cases of the disease and to help out with the cytokine storm on Chris Martenson's series about COVID-19. Thanks for sharing your perspective!

[belltaco]

>The few double-blind trials there have been have focused exclusively on HCQ without the additional viral inhibitors and were done at toxic doses when the virus had largely already replicated and the patients had progressed to a "serious illness" with the accompanied "cytokine storm".

Not true.

July 30, 2020, Research Update

Spanish RCT of Hydroxychloroquine for Patients with Early, Nonsevere COVID-19 Finds No Benefit.

July 29, 2020, Research Update

United States/Canadian RCT of Hydroxychloroquine for Patients with Early, Nonsevere COVID-19 Finds No Benefit

>Lots of bad information out there, 'politically' deployed with little information behind it.

Ironic because you're the one believing and spreading the misinformation.

>I'll leave speculation of motivations behind on why more types of treatments haven't been tried. We're in a strange time when a lot of the institutions that have failed the public are still being weaponized against people who desperately want the best outcome for folks.

Can you explain why India(where HCQ is widely used for malaria) would lock itself down and suffer severe consequences to make Trump look bad? Modi and Trump are buddies and Trump was invited to and visited India just in Jan or Feb.

Why would Europe give a flying fuck about Trump getting re-elected? Four more years would barely make a difference to Europe, surely whatever the impact is, isn't worth a 10% drop in GDP?

>Not a scientist or doctor, but have taken a lot of time to understand how I can protect my family if needed.

If you really took a lot of time to look in the right places, you'd have found that promising observational studies happen all the time in drug discovery which are eventually found not to have any effects.

This explains it well, and it was quite early on:

https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/04/06/hy...

It's sad that so many smart people believe and are misled by misinformation that started with Fox News pushing badly done research studies to push a political agenda. The mistrust intentionally cultivated against scientists will harm us for generations.

[jeanvaljean2463]

To put to rest your straw man argument: Actually wasn't referencing Trump or Fox News at all. I don't watch television at all and Trump is a buffoon. I wish Trump had never even talked about it because then it wouldn't have become taboo for otherwise intelligent people to discuss. I personally don't care if he is re-elected or not, we're on our own regardless.

I rely on facts, not belief. Integrity is important and in short supply in our age.

The author of the article you sent made a great point near the end of his article:

<quote> I called it “potentially very interesting” and called for more data to see if it was real. That’s where I still am. </quote>

I completely agree with this, let's disprove it and strike it off the list, but the studies that I have read so far don't seem to do a good job of disproving.

I appreciate the link and am happy to read what people send, keep sharing information! I am always interested and want to get the best information possible to help the people I know if at all possible. Thanks again for taking the time to share with me.

Here's a link to a pre-print that seems like it holds a pretty promising review of existing studies.

https://www.palmerfoundation.com.au/hydroxychloroquine-is-ef...

[belltaco]

> completely agree with this, let's disprove it and strike it off the list, but the studies that I have read so far don't seem to do a good job of disproving.

That's not how science or research works. The onus is on the ones that are claiming something works to prove it works. So far they have failed. Otherwise one could come up with zillions of alleged treatments that are assumed to work unless someone disproves them.

Anyway, he wrote that in early April. If you read his writings in the next few months he think HCQ doesn't work.

https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/