[thayne]

> the standard library is where packages go to die

I totally understand that sentiment. But that does seem to contradict the "batteries included" philosophy. Then again pip itself seems like one of the batteries you would expect to be included, so maybe that philosophy is just no longer as relevant to python.

[afiori]

my understanding is that the batteries included philosophy wasn't really successful. probably it would have been better if they had a smaller standard library providing core language-level functionality and then many blessed p packages that with independent versioning

[lmm]

It was successful at the time. Remember Python is nearly 30 years old now, and has always had the worst dependency management of any major language.

[thayne]

I don't know c++ dependency management is pretty terrible.

[lmm]

Python now includes pip itself in the standard library (which is a spectacularly poor decision IMO).

[nuclear_eclipse]

Nit: the standard library includes a module to fetch and install pip. It doesn't include pip itself.