[fsflover]

One could argue that Purism, Social Purpose Corporation, is trying to fight with pollution (by providing devices with lifetime updates and choosing their sources) and supports human rights (by using exclusively free software, by creating a new market for surveillance-free user-respecting devices, by trying to shift manufacturing from China to USA).

https://puri.sm/about/manufacturing-and-sourcing/

Not sure if you consider them "well funded" though.

[stann]

From China to US... surveillance-free?

[fsflover]

You can inspect all their source code. They also publish schematics and x-ray images of their phone.

[3np]

I’m so bummed out that they’re basing themselves and manufacturing in the US. It’s such a risk that it’s difficult to make sense of the reasoning with anything else than that they’re already compromised, possibly simply by funding capital that comes with conditions. Not saying I believe that’s the case but how else can you explain it?

[fsflover]

I do not understand people who think that trusting a company is all about geography or funding. The real trust should be built when you and everyone else can verify everything and speak up whenever something is wrong. Most companies do not even allow any reasonable verification (by closing their sources and schematics). Purism is the most transparent company I know.

[3np]

The problem with the US specifically is that the intentions of the current team and founders doesn’t decide in the end. It’s entirely plausible for them to be compromised and gagged, against their will.

It’s also not necessarily something that more than a very small number of people in the company needs to be aware of.

This is due to how legislation and the operations of federal agencies work.

Over the past decade, I feel USA has become pretty damn close China in this regard if you put all countries on some kind of scale.

Anywhere in the EU would have had way less of that risk.

I could also add that I had similar feelings with Keybase for a long time; promising team, solution and openness (though not to the extent of Purism). My main gripe was the US location. And then they were acquired by Zoom. This kind of nihilistic dynamic is also more common with US businesses, even if it’s just a cultural thing.

[fsflover]

1. Purism have the warrant canary.

2. You can check the source code and schematics. Can you do this for any other company in any other country?

3. At least there are courts in the US, not so in China. Practically all electronics is produced in China.

> My main gripe was the US location. And then they were acquired by Zoom.

So the actual problem turned out to be NOT the location, right? Purism is a Social Purpose Corporation, so it's hard (impossible?) to buy them.

[3np]

1. Can’t be trusted

2. I’m not saying I can recommend you a better company with a comparable product. But with the way they’re positioning themselves, they have extremely high standards to live up to.

3. Fair point. Let’s see how the Assange trials go.

Yes, China is a concern but if you’re going to provide a better alternative, why make your base and operations in one of the top 3 remaining global concern countries?

I’ve been keeping checking in on Purism for years and have been close to ordering early several times but this uneasiness is what has been preventing me from pulling the trigger.

You are totally free to make a different judgement call and I respect supporting a good cause where you believe in the team. I also do still hope that Purism does become successful and grow and the team is showing promising progress.

Sadly the US is just too corrupt to have this be trustable and sustainable as things look now. I hope they realize this and move. And that we see more actors in this space.