[talove]

I agree. That doesn't mention the actual product milestones and accomplishments either...

- 10-year lead on the EV market

- Undisputed best product in the EV market (not the cheapest).

- Proprietary charging stations rolled out globally that'd take years (even a decade?) for anyone to catch up with.

- Hands down best autonomous driving system

- Diversified into solar, upcoming diesel.

The audience of Tesla fans is, not my cup of tea. But I can't help but draw some parallels to the $30-40/share Apple days when it started growing and there were similar arguments against it. But in my head I thought, well, have you actually used the laptops? There was nothing close to them.

[rsynnott]

> 10-year lead on the EV market

Their first practical car was introduced two years after the Nissan Leaf.

> Proprietary charging stations rolled out globally that'd take years (even a decade?) for anyone to catch up with.

I'm not sure how well they're doing there globally. There are about 200 fast charging locations in Ireland (mostly CCS/Chademo combo) and 1000 or so 22kW AC ones. Tesla supercharging stations? Two. (They also have a bunch of destination chargers, perhaps 20 or 30). I think they're doing worse in Ireland than in most European countries, but not THAT much worse, and of course the CCS infra in many countries is far better, too.

[xkjkls]

Anyone who says a business has a 10-year lead is lying. There is no business on earth with a 10 year lead.

[est31]

> best product in the EV market

People repeatedly report quality issues with Teslas. Not some minor stuff but stuff like rain getting inside.

> best autonomous driving system

I'd put a big question mark next to this one, because they don't use LIDAR. It's laudable that they want to build camera-only autonomous driving systems, because that makes them more affordable, but this has a cost in quality/performance.

[talove]

re: product. Yea. Known issues with trim, body alignment, etc. Where it really counts tho, drivetrain, range, a computer system that feels a hundred years ahead of any other car tho.

re: auto-pilot. My recent car purchase was almost solely on picking the best autopilot. Current day, short of the Super Cruise nothing compares. I read a lot of "it doesn't actually drive itself" but as of the last few months it literally goes onramp to offramp, handling all the merges and lane changes with zero intervention reliably. It's remarkable. I don't expect anyone is close to complex traffic signals and urban driving regardless of platform.

[andrewmutz]

I own a model S. Yours changes lanes without you telling it to? Yours exits the freeway without you telling it to?

[talove]

Lane change can be configured to happen automatically with FSD in autopilot, I prefer the stick confirmation though.

Yes. Enters and exits freeway without intervention or confirmation. On a recent road trip there were several times where it exited one freeway, circled around, and merged onto another without any intervention at all.

[mzkply]

best autonomous driving system... on the market today. Nothing's shipping with LIDAR.

[mercurysmessage]

Yea, I don't know where the idea that Tesla is the "Best EV" comes from. Hype? Tesla has no where near the quality or standards of other car manufacturers. That makes sense because they are so new.

[tyfon]

The best EV thing comes from the fact that they are best in drive train, efficiency and battery tech.

They don't necessarily build the best cars.

As a tesla owner I'd say they are better bult than most American cars, on par with German but behind the Japanese.

Five years ago I would have agreed that they don't have quality cars (even though they were still the best EV). I was refusing to go near them for several years after test driving a "classic" model S with rattles and squeaks and all that, but at least in my own car (2019, model X "raven") these kind of things are non-existent.

Edit: On topic, I also think that the stock is crazy high.

[mercurysmessage]

What do you think about the problems some are having with panels coming off?

Yea the stock is insane, it'll be interesting to see where it goes.

[tyfon]

I have yet to see any panels come off or heard of any with such issues in real life, I think that must be a very tiny minority if so.

Where I work (in Norway) about 10% of the employees have teslas and there are not more issues than most fossils except for the Toyotas perhaps :)