[Scottopherson]

Will your trivial custom payment system come with counter-intuitive modal popups? Unclear subscription/unsubscription terms? Inaccessible or hostile refund or return policies?

I don't want to prematurely insinuate that you or other's solutions would all have such characteristics but as a consumer I don't care how developers get paid and I enjoy the benefits of Apple's integrated UX around iOS payments and subscriptions.

But I am also a developer and enjoy benefits of open-ness and choice in my work as well so I struggle with my opinions on this issue.

[paxys]

Funny because I recently tried to cancel an in-app subscription I signed up for through Apple and it was borderline impossible. I'd much rather prefer to have a cancellation option in the app itself, but Apple doesn't allow that. In fact Apple's in-app payment/subscription UX checks every single box in your list.

[zimpenfish]

I cancelled something the other day - got an email saying it was up for renewal in 90 days or thereabouts with a link to the subscription page and a set of options where "cancel" was afforded the same screen real estate as the continue options. Not entirely onerous, I think, two clicks?

But ok, you might want to cancel before you get the reminder email. Settings -> Your Name/Avatar -> Subscriptions -> Pick the app -> Big red "Cancel Subscription" button.

But ok, ok, you might not know that they're under your avatar which is fair, it's not entirely intuitive. Settings -> Search -> "sub" -> Subscriptions is the first result -> Pick the app -> Big red "Cancel Subscription" button.

But ok, ok, ok, you don't have your iOS device to hand. macOS Settings -> Apple ID -> Subscriptions: Manage... -> Edit the subscription (this is broken on the Big Sur beta, mind.)

If you don't have your iOS device(s) to hand, nor do you have a Mac handy, then I concede it's going to be a bit faff - https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT211011

[saagarjha]

> Will your trivial custom payment system come with counter-intuitive modal popups? Unclear subscription/unsubscription terms? Inaccessible or hostile refund or return policies?

You mean like Apple's solution?

[blub]

WTF are you talking about? Subscriptions on iOS are the nicest, most customer-friendly I've ever seen on any computing platform ever.

[kanobo]

I've never been able to get a refund on a purchase on iOS app or ever had a customer email to the App Store get responded. I think you might just be commenting on the UI? In that case - yes absolutely, it is visually pretty and easy to buy stuff.

[cullenking]

Our small business could fund dedicated programmers and accountants to handle all that and still come out ahead compared to what we get hit by Apple for. 30% of annual revenue on Apple devices per year is millions for many small software companies. Money we used to get from direct web sales. And we have a nightmare time getting app updates released due to their opaque and unfriendly review process with no accountability. Not to mention their horrific tooling. Apple is a blight on the industry.

[valuearb]

Yet you stay because the App Store brings you a steady stream of customers who are comfortable buying your app because of those App Review policies, the installation security, and its clear purchasing and subscription system and policies.

Perhaps you don’t have free versions of your apps, but Apple also pays to distribute unlimited free apps for no charge. And Apple spends roughly 50% of what you pay it on providing all these services, you can’t do them cheaper and you can’t do the most important on your own.

If I didn’t have to pay rent I could hire more developers, but my landlord isn’t holding me back, they are enabling me to close more business. You want lose sales on a worse App Store, I pray we don’t get waist you want.

[cullenking]

It does not cost Apple millions of dollars to distribute our app. The only viable choice to not releasing on iOS is not having a business, one that started on the web and due to customer demand, moved to iOS. I get the value they provide, but it’s clearly not in line with the cost they charge.

[ryanbrunner]

I mean, all of these things are pretty straightforward with Stripe today. I guarantee if the ecosystem were more open there would be a drop-in replacement for Apple's system by Stripe available in practically no time.

If Apple wants to compete on offering a better, more seamless experience, there's nothing stopping them from doing so. I don't think anyone is arguing that Apple shouldn't offer payment processing altogether. A 30% cut and anti-competitive stance towards other payment methods don't feel like competing to provide the best experience to me though.

[valuearb]

Who is going to paye for app distribution, app review, search, hosting infrastructure and all the other critical features developers and consumers need?

[ryanbrunner]

All of these things exist and have healthy competition on the web, where competition is allowed to exist and there's no gatekeepers demanding a 30% cut of revenues.