[cutler]

Yes, I suppose what really worries me about the "Modern PHP" movement how it looks down on anything that isn't Java-style OO. Procedural PHP is now considered to be some kind of unwashed Cinderella. I cringe when I look at a typical PSR-compliant page of PHP with its K&R braces, blank lines between each line of code and fanfold doc comments. You're lucky if you get more than a handful of lines of business logic on a screen.

[ChrisMarshallNY]

I never learned Java until late in my career (when I learned up on Android). I started as an EE, and my programming has been primarily self-taught.

PHP is a kind of crappy OO language, but it is sufficient. I think Java is a better language, for OO. PHP 7+ is lot better than it was, before 5.

A lot of Java programmers came out of school, and started to create PHP chimeras. I feel as if that results in unnecessarily complex code. Things are complex enough, without applying UI-style MVC to server backend systems.

I wrote PHP for around twenty years, starting off procedural and mixed into HTML pages, to OO-based pure PHP systems.

I stopped a couple of years ago. This was my final PHP project[0][1]. It was sort of a "dissertation." No one is actually interested in using it, but it was developed in order to practice my architectural skills. It's a pretty intense system.

[0] https://riftvalleysoftware.com/work/open-source-projects/#ba...

[1] https://github.com/RiftValleySoftware/basalt/tree/master