[controversy]

EVs will require a mind change. I have a hybrid. I drive it in St Augustine FL, America’s oldest city. As such the roads in the historic district are narrow.

When I come to an intersection I have to be especially conscientious because pedestrians are use to engine noise bouncing down the road ahead of the car. People have walked out in front of me unaware of my existence. I normally mouth, “Surprise, motha fucka” or “I’m Batman” when that happens.

[cerberusss]

Yeah people will need to get aware of that. I'm European and drive a Renault Zoe. It plays some sort of "whoooooo" noise from under the bonnet/hood when you drive slower than 30 km (19 mi).

On one hand, I think it's dumb because why am I explicitly making noise? So I turned it off. But then I scared the living hell out of two shopping ladies when I unintentionally crept up behind them, and now I always leave it on.

[imhoguy]

Not much benefit from any kind of engine and noise when people walk or cycle with earphones. That is very usual view for me nowadays. Worse if they also stare at they phones too - blind and deaf at will.

[ghaff]

I've said this before in comments but I just really have trouble understanding people who can walk--especially in cities--with earphones. I know some are less isolating than others--some like the pass through mode on the Airpod Pros. But I don't even really like earphones on a forest path much less a city street.

I guess it's somewhat a matter of what you're used to. I grew up pre-Walkman and have just never gotten into the habit of wearing earphones like that.

[servercobra]

In the US, EVs and hybrids will be required (I'm unclear on the details from the articles I've seen though) to emit artificial noise under 18.6 mph by Sept 2020, and in the EU, under 15 mph by July 2021. [0] Hopefully that will help some, but I'm not excited for the first wave of noises. I'm betting a few are going to be really annoying.

[0] https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/1/20676854/electric-cars-art...

[withinboredom]

I'm looking forward to it. I use hearing when coming up on intersections in my neighborhood and on a bicycle. The visibility is terrible. I'm never at risk of being run over, but it always shocks me pretty good to see a car coming towards the intersection without a sound. I can hear up to 19khz so I usually hear the batteries/motors, but not all cars make that sound.

[jrussino]

I empathize with this viewpoint, but I can't understate how strongly I oppose this idea. Road noise is extremely unpleasant! If somehow the electric motor vehicle had been invented first instead of the ICE there is no way anybody would have proposed that we make them artificially louder... we can put other, much more effective traffic safety measures in place.

I too enjoy cycling and understand that there are serious safety problems involved with cars and bikes sharing the road and that and most of our cities have done a poor job of dealing with them. I don't think keeping around legacy noise pollution is the answer. It reminds me of this: https://xkcd.com/1172/

[shados]

> Road noise is extremely unpleasant

We have to stop treating noise as a mere annoyance or as something that "Karens" bitch about because of their priviledge.

It's polution, a health issue, something that ruins quality of life, and for people with certain health issues can be a chronic problem. It prevents people from sleeping, focusing, lowers productivity, make people "dumber", you name it.

In a lot of ways, the impact of noise can be similar to that of lead pipes. And we act like we can just tell people to deal with it, and that white noise machines and earplugs (hello ear infections!) are a solution (spoiler. I use both and it barely makes a dent in the noise sometimes).

[wizzwizz4]

> we can put other, much more effective traffic safety measures in place.

Like? (Don't limit yourself to the easy-to-introduce-today; not everywhere has established road infrastructure, and your ideas could be used there.)

[withinboredom]

Anything louder than "silent" is good, but it need not be nearly as loud as an ICE engine.

[heavenlyblue]

How is that an issue for you and not an issue for drivers who obviously can’t hear other cars?

[fian]

Cyclists who ride regularly in traffic subconsciously use sound and to a lesser extent air pressure to detect and map the movements of larger vehicles. Unlike eyesight requires a head movement to detect anything not in a field of view in front of the cyclist, sound and air pressure changes can be detected from all directions. The noise of a car approaching from the rear gives an early indication that you are about to be overtaken, which reduces the potential to be surprised/frightened. Similarly the air pressure change can give an indication of the size of the vehicle - getting overtaken by a prime mover is different to a hatchback.

Increasingly, modern car drivers are enclosed in noise dampened, environmentally controlled environments with some sort of sound entertainment playing (music, podcast, talkback radio). So car drivers are less able to make good use of sound and other cues for detecting other traffic.

The lack of sound from hybrid cars, for example the Toyota Prius when accelerating in electric mode, has caught me by surprise while cycling. Not knowing you are about to be overtaken can be dangerous because there is an instinctive fight/flight response which can cause a sudden flinch or overreaction away from the surprise and you naturally turn your head to look at the perceived danger. As you are normally cycling on the edge of the roadway there is a higher potential to now accidentally ride over/into an obstruction (drainage grate, kerb, pothole) and come off your bike.

[ck425]

That or we can get to a point where we reduce cars in cities to a minimum. We'll probably still need car noise for the few that exist but the better solution in most ways is just to have way less cars.

[andrekandre]

i have a crazy dream that all roads would be underground... how beautiful the landscape would be without roads...

[jacquesm]

You'd need a lot of exit ramps going up though, and it would be pretty tricky for emergency services to reach the places they need to go to. Personally I'm a big fan of reducing through traffic as much as possible and banning vehicles other than for the disabled and emergency services from city cores.

[andrekandre]

yea, i think logistically its super hard and most likely not practical at all, but it would be amazing if possible...

[wizzwizz4]

Have you read Eliezer Yudkowsky's April Fools' Day confession? https://yudkowsky.tumblr.com/post/81447230971/my-april-fools...

[andrekandre]

i havent, thanks for the link ^^

> We could have big houses, with windows that shutter in the summer mornings to keep out every bit of the too-early light of dawn, or shutter in the night to leave the stars absolutely untouched. We could have roofs that let in the sun.

oh god, yes please!

[johnny_reilly]

Are you Batman?

[pfraze]

That’s a controversy

[rzzzt]

Nobody saw them in the same place at the same time, so...