[coder543]

> they really are just integers, even more than in C# or C++, even though there is no implicit conversion.

What do you mean by this?

C#: https://repl.it/repls/ExhaustedDisgustingRam

C++: https://repl.it/repls/BackGroundedRobot

C# and C++ offer exactly the same thing that Go offers... enums that are really just integers.

You can assign arbitrary values to those C# and C++ enums, even though you're not supposed to, just like in Go.

Rust offers something truly better, where the enum abstraction doesn't leak at all.

[scatters]

In C++, you get an error at runtime: https://godbolt.org/z/C_JFez

Note though that C++ allows using enums as bitfields, so some form of loading non-enumerated values has to be allowed.

[coder543]

> In C++, you get an error at runtime

Your statement implies that errors for using invalid values are guaranteed at runtime as a feature of the language. That entire statement is incorrect.

You really don't get errors... I literally pasted a link to a working, non-erroring example in the comment that you responded to. You clearly saw the code. Did you click "run"?

You only get an error at runtime if you add "-fsanitize=undefined" (or "-fsanitize=enum"), where the compiler will inject some code into your binary.

But the error doesn't actually stop code execution: it just prints a warning!

Here is a link with the sanitizer enabled, and no warning is even printed for using an invalid value: https://godbolt.org/z/NA7FNQ

So, not only is the sanitizer not even comprehensive, it's not actually a feature of C++. It's a best-effort feature from the compiler to add a non-standard runtime code sanitizer to your binary. Warnings for using invalid values are not guaranteed.

[josephcsible]

You had to use casts to get those to compile. Go will let you shoot yourself in the foot by accidentally writing "z = 3", which is way more likely than accidentally writing "z = (Something)3".

[coder543]

The point is that those languages’ enums are very much integers too. Do those languages allow you to write out as many types of integers literally in your code? No. But that’s not the point being addressed here. You can reread the comment I was responding to, and there’s no hint that I can see anywhere that they’re talking about untyped literals.

The point I’m making is that C# and C++ enums are not exhaustive, and not guaranteed to be any particular predefined value. They’re just integers. (unlike Rust: https://play.rust-lang.org/?gist=c9e499ba8d3abe08e5e54c74f54...)

C#, C++, and Go all share the same flawed enum representation strategy. Use Rust if you want to get better enums... those other languages aren't any better for enums. C#, C++, and Go enums are all type safe, and they're all perfectly capable of holding completely unexpected values. (Although, C++ in the older permissive mode was not type safe period when it came to enums, if I remember correctly. I admit it's been long enough that I could be misremembering.)

I already addressed your point in detail with you elsewhere.

Please, by all means review the final 3 lines I wrote in this comment for more info: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23715897

I agree that being allowed to write any type of integer as a literal is theoretically an ergonomic issue when it comes to enums, but it’s one issue I’ve literally never seen happen even once in practice. I point out that there are linters available to address the issue if it’s one you feel so strongly about. Surely you use linters in every language?

I have been paid professionally for years to work in both Rust and Go codebases. Linters are essential for both languages, and CI is where you guarantee that no lint-failing code is allowed to pass.

I’m well aware of Go’s flaws, but people throughout this thread (yourself included) have made tons of baseless claims about Go. Just because it’s popular to hate on a given language doesn’t make it okay to use incorrect statements for that purpose, such as saying that Go’s enums aren’t type safe. They are a separate type. The language does allow you to write integer literals of any integer type. It also does this with untyped float and untyped string literals as well, as a fun fact.

Go has a number of legitimate flaws, including the absence of both generics and sum types. You could even legitimately complain about untyped literals —- they are really nice in some ways, but they do have some trade offs.