[bJGVygG7MQVF8c]

Answering for myself / at the level of the individual: yes.

I don't want to work with white colleagues who are biased against non-white people. I have been in this situation at a very small startup. I wasn't the only person to notice or complain about it, so I know it wasn't "in my head". So I left.

But I also don't want to work someplace where white colleagues are overcorrecting for deep-seated cultural biases. Ideally they don't have to correct at all. I've been in that situation as well, at a large company with a extremely woke / "D&I" culture. So I left.

Exit isn't a systemic solution — only an individual one, and only for market participants with options.

It's also not cheap, but the psychological and emotional cost of being judged by group membership -- for me, at least, is greater.

I think it's worth keeping in mind that the kind of pan-social "affirmative action" advocated by diversity consultants is a double-edged sword, and not without its own risks and costs. At best it's a stopgap measure of sorts. (The diversity consultant operates under perverse incentives, and doesn't have anything like a Hippocratic Oath constraining his/her advocacy.)

I've been lucky and have found a few places where that pervasive sense of cultural bias wasn't present. It would be easier to find such places if startups, and engineering teams in particular, would try to hew to traditional standards of professionalism on the job.

[xfitm3]

> I don't want to work with white colleagues who are biased against non-white people.

I don't want to work with people who are biased against white people. I support equality and I genuinely want to see people treated fairly but I can't help but take offense to the notion that because I'm white I am less or should feel guilty.

[komali2]

Allyship for POC doesn't imply bias against white people. Acknowledging and fighting against systemic racism doesn't imply that all white people should feel universal guilt for their very real privilege.

Raising others up doesn't require pushing anyone down. Well, anyone that isn't in a white hood, anyway.

[bJGVygG7MQVF8c]

> Allyship for POC doesn't imply bias against white people.

Sure, in theory. In practice, bias against whites exists, some of it catalyzed by woke ideology. (By woke logic) White-presenting people are really the only ones with standing to speak to such bias in their own lives.

> Well, anyone that isn't in a white hood, anyway.

Ah yes, the IRL downvote: call someone a racist / Nazi / fascist / Klansman.

[mcv]

> "Ah yes, the IRL downvote: call someone a racist / Nazi / fascist / Klansman."

But it does need to be called out when it happens. Otherwise we allow it to continue. Protecting the status quo is not neutral or unbiased when the status quo is marginalising certain groups. And no, white people are really not remotely marginalised in any meaningful way in western countries.

[komali2]

Where did I call anyone a klansman? I'm saying you can bring up the oppressed minority populations without putting anyone else down, with the explicit exception of people who are punished by society for their hateful ideology.

> bias against whites exists

Not in any meaningful way, especially when compared to the experience of POC in America.

> some of it catalyzed by woke ideology.

Sometimes racists lose their jobs. That's not racism against white people.

> White-presenting people are really the only ones with standing to speak to such bias in their own lives.

I'm white. We don't experience meaningful bias. Trying to claim so is just attempting to appropriate victimhood from actual victims, and detracts from anti-racist movements.

Another paragraph before someone angrily hits reply and says "BUT WHITE PEOPLE IN TRAILER PARKS! BUT AFFIRMATIVE ACTION!" I said meaningful bias. I've experienced racial discomfort. Doesn't change the fact that no matter what angle you take, my life would've been harder if I'd been born black.

[nec4b]

You really should try to travel and visit places out of your comfort zone to see how other people live, before dismissing their hardships.

[komali2]

You really should engage in good faith instead of combing through nearly all of my comments in this thread and shitting out drive by rhetorically fallacious comments.