[downerending]

The "targeted medical tents" part sounds rather dubious, but yes, "less lethal" most certainly does not mean "harmless".

What would be better, though? How do you get people to obey the law, in a way that is safer for all concerned?

[williamdclt]

> How do you get people to obey the law, in a way that is safer for all concerned?

Start by not shooting at them, especially when the protest is legal.

Escalation is the big problem here, nobody is complaining about using rubber bullet against dangerous armed people. They're complaining about using rubber bullet against people in a non-violent protest. If the police is using significantly more force than their "targets", there's an escalation problem

[downerending]

I don't think they are using significantly more force. Looking at the riots across the US, the police appear in general to be showing an almost saintly level of restraint, and being killed and severely injured as a result.

This is simply too much to ask.

[williamdclt]

Wow, you'll have to provide extraordinary proof to this extraordinary claim that goes against so much evidence.

What I've seen (from outside the US) is the exact opposite, police shooting, beating and killing protestors while they were peacefully protesting (or medics, or journalists, or people in their own homes).

[Nursie]

This has to be trolling. The whole thing started because of the police literally committing murder, and in most cases closing ranks and getting away with it.

[qaz_plm]

You seem to be confusing “protests” and “riots”

[_qwfv]

I strongly disagree. Footage from protest after protest shows police firing weapons into crowds, causing permanent injuries with zero accountability.

As far as I am aware, no active police officers have been killed by protesters. (One was killed by a right wing extremist.) Meanwhile, several protesters have been killed by police at these protests. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Floyd_protests#Violence...

[nitwit005]

The police aren't supposed to punish people. The courts are supposed to determine guilt and and punishment, as everyone has a right to a jury trial.

Tear gas, rubber bullets, and any other form of violence is only supposed to be used when people are somehow in real danger. That's why the police often insist they are "protecting themselves", as they tear gas protesters who weren't doing anything remotely threatening. They're pretending that they're obeying the law.

[Pfhreak]

The medical tent targeting is currently being investigated by the Seattle OPA, and has several eyewitness accounts. We'll see where the OPA lands (though, the OPA is composed of mostly police officers, so....)

What would be better? Stand down. Let the protests protest. Listen to the concerns, make changes.

[Nursie]

What would be better, from the perspective of a non-US person, would be having a de-militarised police force who were trained in de-escalation and the application of force (any force) as a last resort.

[chrisseaton]

> How do you get people to obey the law

Arrest them and let them face proper justice.

Weapons should be for defence only.

[cryptoz]

> How do you get people to obey the law, in a way that is safer for all concerned?

When the law states that you cannot leave your home after 1pm in the afternoon, or after 7pm at night, I do not think that any level of enforcement, of any kind, will prevent Americans from breaking the law.

Most of the lethal and harmful force used by the police in the US recently was at the excuse of the peaceful protesters being out "past curfew" even at 2pm in the afternoon. The simplest way to prevent that violence would have been to not employ a curfew to the citizens at insane and unruly hours - or frankly, at all.

The next simplest way would be to reduce the anger felt by the population at the police. That would mean that nationwide, there would have to have been coordinated police action to not needlessly harm and kill peaceful protesters. The last month saw the opposite strategy from police, seemingly coordinated because it was so ruthlessly violent across the country, nearly all stemming from unprovoked police actions.

Even better actually, would be to stop the systemic racism and police terrorism and brutality in the first place. Ensure that no police officer is likely or even able to randomly kill someone they have detained, like George Floyd. Especially when there is clear racial bias in the police departments across the country that harms black and minority groups.

Less police violence, less racism, less systematic oppression of the already oppressed == A lot more law-obeying citizens.

Gassing and shooting innocent civilians indiscriminately after killing an unarmed-and-already-detained black man is not a path to peace or an orderly, law-obeying society.

[klyrs]

https://crosscut.com/2020/06/medics-say-police-have-targeted...

[makotech222]

The right to protest is constitutionally protected, but whatever.