[taneq]

From experience, the main issues, aside from weather, with using a motorcycle as your sole means of transport are:

- You can't take an arbitrary person as passenger (they need gear and pillion experience)

- You can't take more than a backpack's worth of cargo (slightly expandable with panniers)

This can't take a passenger at all, and looks like it has the same cargo restrictions. It looks fun but I can't see it replacing a small car which solves both of these problems, so it needs to be cheap enough to be a 'fun' second vehicle.

[cortesoft]

There is also the danger factor... you are 27 times more likely to die driving the same distance on a motorcycle as in a car. I don’t think I would want to take that risk.

[adrianN]

Part of the difference could be explainable by different demographics. Maybe motorcyclists drive more dangerously than normal even when they're in a car.

[taneq]

"Nobody rides a big-bore sports bike this far out into the countryside in order to do the speed limit."

Even if people drive their cars safely, the huge difference in performance means they're more likely to get in trouble on a bike.

[throwlaplace]

What is the absolute number? Eg 27*0 is still 0 (note I'm not suggesting it's actually 0)

[TylerE]

It’s also a more nuanced issue than that. A larger proportion of bike fatalities involve alcohol.

[HarryHirsch]

There is much more: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_findings_in_the_Hurt_R...

[stonogo]

I thought this was the appeal of the 'full touring' bikes from Harley and Honda? Do you still need pinion experience when you're basically in a recliner?

[taneq]

Not nearly as much as if you're perched on the back of a 600 supersport (and if the pillion does start thrashing around it's far less of an issue since they're a smaller fraction of the overall vehicle weight) but it's still a bit of an acquired skillset.

[pengaru]

Pillion experience has more to do with not panicking and not upsetting the balance especially when cornering.

[LilBytes]

100,000+ km in total under my belt. Pillions in my experience pick it up quite quickly and this is across super sports, super nakeds and adventure tourers.

I tell them either lean with me when I'm going around a bend or stay directly up right. I've not had any problems. And I've had a fair number of Tinder Dates with people without any experience of riding who've came accustomed quite quickly.

[pengaru]

Sure, it's not hard to acclimate at all.

But I too have ridden heaps of miles in a previous life when I'd habitually tour the US on two wheels, and there can definitely be frustrations and risks with inexperienced passengers.

From having to convince them things like No, your Keds are not satisfactory for us to go riding. Yes, you must wear a helmet and some pants and gloves would be smart. No, you should not lean into the corners, just be a predictable appendage of the bike especially at low speeds. No, you should not put your foot anywhere near the chain/chain guard, regardless of how annoyingly high the rear pegs are on this superbike. Yes, you must hold on to me and not let go and bail in a panic, yes, even if the front end comes off the ground and you're looking at the sky briefly.

This walk down memory lane reminds me of the time I had to give my ex a ride to work when her car wouldn't start. I had an 04 R1 back then and she never rode on the back before because she was terrified of the thing, and I never had taken passengers on it because it was so poorly suited to it, I actually had to put passenger pegs on for that trip. Just breathing on the throttle in first with her on the back would pull the front end off the ground, it was comically bad with the combination of short wheelbase, high CoG of the passenger on that steep tail, and liter bike tq. When she got off at work she was shaking with fear and said she almost fell off the first time the front end came up a bit and that was having significant experience riding on the back of my previous sport-tourer.

On that previous sport-tourer years prior we had an annoying spill where she was leaned over to see around my helmet while we were riding in an unfamiliar part of Chicago when the front end locked up briefly over an oily patch on Ashland braking for a light. Due to her leaning to see around me we were down and tumbling down the road in the blink of an eye, it was rather shocking but things happen quickly when the front end locks up with a passenger leaned over. Fortunately we walked away with just skinned knees, bruised egos, and a ground through stator cover.

[LilBytes]

Ouch! Thanks for sharing the stories.

My Kawasaki Z900 (2017) is pretty comical for wheelies, more so with a pillion on your R1 as you noted.

Here's a pick of a stock version of the bike. Because of the position of the pillion seat, it being so far to the rear, the short swing arm and because the pillion seat sits so far up and away from the rider. The front wheel lifts with such a trivial amount of power to the front.

I've still had a few rides on it with pillions but god damn, like you said. It does not inspire confidence with an additional passenger.

The Adventure Tourers I've had I was a lot more comfortable with, to date that's a Tiger 800 (2015) and a current Kawasaki Versys 2020 (1000CC). Both were great for additional passengers. Especially the Versys with the electronic suspension to cater for additional pillions or luggage.

My experience with riding with pillions must be close to, maybe, 2-3000km at best. And that's being generous. I've not had any accidents with a pillion, only when solo. As you've shown, motorbikes are fickle beasts.

[theshadowknows]

Don’t forget the spiders!