[dxsh]

Sweden has much larger nursing homes than, for example, Norway, and most deaths in Sweden are from nursing homes. The time integral of the curve over 1 year will tell the real story.

[danesparza]

So are you arguing those numbers are acceptable because of the size of nursing homes in Sweden? Or am I missing something in your 2 sentences?

[icebraining]

I think they're saying that Norway would also have the same number of deaths as Sweden if they had the same number of nursing homes.

[giantDinosaur]

Come on. He's pointing out both an explanatory factor, i.e. larger groups of vulnerable clustered together, and also saying that the total deaths may end up being very similar between countries and that it is too early to tell. Without a vaccine or effective treatment, there's no long term alternative to something akin to the Swedish strategy.

[raziel2p]

Do you have a source on that?

[empath75]

Most deaths in most countries are in nursing homes. Do we not care if older people die?

[aga98mtl]

I think the point was that the total death count at this time is related with the size of nursing homes. Norway has numerous very small nursing home. Sweden has very big nursing home. All over the world we see that big nursing homes are impossible to protect. Belgium locked down harder than Sweden but has the worst stats in Europe. The nursing home death are often 80% to 90% of all death.

COVID-19 is bad, but if you exclude the nursing homes from the stats it doesnt justify the lockdown damage. Is there a realistic plan to isolate big nursing homes somewhere?

[giantDinosaur]

Given that basically nobody wants to end up in a nursing home, but do, often to face neglect and abuse, I'd say that no, we don't really care what happens to old people in nursing homes. Out of sight, out of mind. Yeah, sure, people with a lot of moral indignation will gnash their teeth at such a claim, but I just can't see how they're actually good places to be, and how if we really cared we'd structure our society in a way that makes them necessary.

[tomatotomato37]

You don't have to do a full lockdown if you just want to protect nursing homes; isolation of just the nursing homes/other high-risk concentrated populations would have the same effect on those inside

[pjc50]

And their staff. And all family members of their staff. It's not "impossible", but I don't think any countries have attempted such a nursing-home-only lockdown.

[throwaway0a5e]

We care, but we care less than if people with their whole life ahead of them die.

That's the whole point of YPLL and other age adjusted metric that the scientist and academics who study disease, pollution, etc. use.

[jacobush]

UK also shut down fairly hard and that still didn't stop the spread in nursing homes. So lockdown does not automatically seem to stop the contagion from coming into nursing homes.

Makes sense really. Maybe a focused effort should be made to protect nursing homes.

[pjc50]

The UK shut down too late. People at the time of the Cheltenham Festival (10-13 March) were saying it shouldn't have happened, and now: https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/apr/29/racing-ireland...

[daleharvey]

The UK did not shut down very hard nor early, New Zealands recently "relaxed" lockdown is basically the same has what the UK has been under